Monday, September 22, 2008

Jews, Religion and the Democratic Party

Roger Simon at PJM has a message for Jews who have looked to the Democrats as a kind of religion:

From the days of FDR, the vast majority of American Jews have identified with the Democratic Party almost if it were their religion. This included most especially secular Jews like me whose blasé attitude toward their faith and toward religious observance in general made such a replacement all the more important emotionally. This same Jewish majority also identified with the cause of social justice and, as Barack Obama among many others has noted, were some of the most active participants in the civil rights movement of the Fifties and Sixties. That was all how it should have been and was a perfectly logical and praiseworthy epoch in the development of our country.

Hello – those days are over!


Those days are long gone, I have trouble understanding why Jews don't change course when the political climate changes. Many are stuck in the 60's, thinking that the Democrats are on their side. They aren't. When will Jews wake up and realize that the party they thought was their friend is currently anything but?

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36 Comments:

Blogger br549 said...

The democrats were in power during WWII. The results of WWII, for the Jews, was rescue from being wiped out, thank God. Perhaps they stick with democrats for the same reason they still to this day (for the most part) won't own a Mercedes.

6:16 AM, September 22, 2008  
Blogger Helen said...

br549,

The Roosevelt Administration consistently refused to permit immigration of Jewish refugees. No one really knew what was going on with the Holocaust and the dire situation of the Jews until well after the war started. The Japanese attacked us at Pearl Harbor which is the primary reason the US got involved in the war--not the fate of the Jews.

6:56 AM, September 22, 2008  
Blogger Larry J said...

Ah, those ever-enlightened 1960s civil rights Democrats, like George Wallace, Lester Maddox, Bull Connor, and a host of senators (including Al Gore's father) who did everything possible to slow or stop the civil rights movement. Yes, there were northern Democrats who worked for civil rights but as LBJ admitted, the Civil Rights Act of 1964 would've never passed except for the support of the Republicans in Congress.

8:15 AM, September 22, 2008  
Blogger Archivist said...

I, too, am perplexed by the Jewish alliance with the Democratic party, which in some important ways has become the party of intolerance.

I suspect a significant part of it is a fear of the evangelical Christian wing of the Republican party, which isn't nearly as big or as scary as they might think. They are among the staunchest supporters of Israel. In any event, many Jews seem to wrongly lump all "Christians" together -- including the 23% of the population that is Catholic (and many practicing Catholics will tell you they feel greater affinity for their Jewish brethren than for evangelical Christians, which regards Catholicism as the enemy.)

I don't understand how Jews ally themselves with a candidate who wants to try to reason with the madman in Iran, given his unequivocal hatred for Israel.

I don't understand how Jews can ally themselves with a party that counts as one of its stalwarts a man who referred to New York City as "hymie town" and who was bacially given a free pass for saying it. (The same man more recently stated that he wanted to castrate Obama, and again he was pretty much given a free pass.) Does anyone think that if a prominent Jew made an equivalent comment about blacks it would have been treated with such tolerance?

The Jewish alliance with the modern day Democratic party is largely an emotional one, not a rational one.

8:42 AM, September 22, 2008  
Blogger TMink said...

Archivist wrote: "many practicing Catholics will tell you they feel greater affinity for their Jewish brethren than for evangelical Christians, which regards Catholicism as the enemy."

I do not know these Evangelicals who think of Catholics as the enemy. I do know some Evangelical Catholics though. Seriously, these people do not come to the meetings I go to.

Trey

9:31 AM, September 22, 2008  
Blogger Peregrine John said...

Inertia and ego.

It's easier to not change; it's hard to change from something you've volubly supported. Together, a potent reason to generate cognitive dissonance.

10:18 AM, September 22, 2008  
Blogger jay c said...

The Libertarian and Constitution parties are the only real friends the Jews have in American political parties. As far as I know, they are the only ones who believe that Jews have the right to defend themselves (and to possess the means to defend themselves) from the most dangerous form of anti-semitism. The Republicans say they do, but their actions say something else.

10:18 AM, September 22, 2008  
Blogger Quasimodo said...

"I do not know these Evangelicals who think of Catholics as the enemy. I do know some Evangelical Catholics though. Seriously, these people do not come to the meetings I go to."

Plenty of them exist but, again, in far fewer numbers and with far less influence than the some want us to believe.
Also, Joe and Sally Sixpack Catholic are nearly completely unaware of them ... no where close to their radar screens. And for good reason.

2:39 PM, September 22, 2008  
Blogger TMink said...

Quasimodo, I am a little confused. Are you saying that there are a few bigots but not many, and that the few are being exaggerated?

Where do you meet these people?

Seriously!

I know that nuts like Tony Alamo exist, but among mainstream Evangelicals, I do not know any Evangelical who thinks or writes with a Catholic bias.

I am not saying that they do not exist, I am saying that they are rare in my 40 years of going to church.

Trey

3:35 PM, September 22, 2008  
Blogger DADvocate said...

I know at least one girl in my high school wouldn't go out with me because I was Catholic. She was Baptist, I believe. But, of course, I graduated nearly 40 years ago.

I still know some Christians who look down their noses at Catholics but they aren't strongly prejudice. One I know is an ex-Catholic. I know plenty more non-Christians who have much harsher opinions of Christians in general.

3:55 PM, September 22, 2008  
Blogger Danny said...

In my experience, a lot of left -leaning Jews are Christian-phobic. They especially hate Evangelicals and Catholics and Mormons, or any Christian denomination that hasnt bent over backwards to embrace gay right.
The Jews who are non-practising Jews too hold these anti-Christian views. And if you read magazines like Tikkun ( leftist rag edited by Rabbi Michael Lerner), traditional Christians are portrayed as some kind of knuckle-dragging, anti-Semites, which is very far from the truth as can be possible

7:46 PM, September 22, 2008  
Blogger Jack said...

I am a registered democrat who considers himself to be independent. I cross party lines based upon the issue.

I don't trust any political party to protect my family, friends or myself. You can tell me all you want that I am misguided, but experience says otherwise.

The parties will do what is politically expedient and beyond that all bets are off.

And if we want to talk about history than I can refer to family members who remember when neighbors in Europe turned upon them.

You just don't know what will happen in a crisis. Some people will do the right thing and others will not.

As for the evangelicals, well that is a mixed bag. From a collective standpoint it is hard to feel good about people who support you because of an agenda.

And while some of you may think that witnessing is ok, it is considered to be highly offensive by many of us.

Consider how you'd feel if millions of dollars were spent on organized campaigns to convert you and your families.

And then consider how you might feel if those who did so said that you shouldn't be angry because it is done out of love.

From an individual standpoint, I judge people based upon their actions, not their religion.

Because in the end that is the only real way to measure a person.

3:25 AM, September 23, 2008  
Blogger Quasimodo said...

Tmink - I don't know if you are still paying attention here but yes, I am saying that there are bigots out there. I believe their numbers are small, but perhaps not. More to the point they are mostly harmless.

Where do I meet them? At work - "I hear you belong to the world's largest cult." At school - I have a story identical to dadvocate. In college, "you're a bunch of drunks." But as I say, they are either small in number or the vocal ones are small in number and the rest are harmless - amusing actually. How could they miss the message SO completely?

9:09 AM, September 23, 2008  
Blogger NJArtist said...

The Jews were wrong when they chose the socialist ideology under F.D.R. and they are just as wrong now. They were blind then and they continue to be blind now. There is no surprise.

There is no true historic memory in the Jewish mind: the centralized state, socialist state is not a new phenomenon. The centralized state demands the worship of its subjects: from the image of Nebuchadnezzar to the Cult of Personality today, these are the same things with the same consequences.

11:43 AM, September 23, 2008  
Blogger Jenny said...

TMink,

I think it depends on where you are. Being in the South, where Catholics are a minority, you run into it more than you would think.

Once my cousin's 11 year old daughter (they are Baptist) said that she really liked one of her friends even though she was Catholic. My cousin immediately hushed her and told her that I was Catholic. The girl was very embarrassed. But really where does an 11 year old hear such things.

It is not as loud as it used to be, but the undercurrent still exists.

12:35 PM, September 23, 2008  
Blogger Quasimodo said...

Jenny,
I've lived my entire life in the north. It ain't just the South.

3:55 PM, September 23, 2008  
Blogger br549 said...

I was born into and raised in a "Catholic society" if you will, the first 10 years of my life. Our huge neighborhood was all military officers from all services, and almost all Catholic. I just didn't realize that's what it was. I thought it was normal for all kids in a neighborhood to go to the same school, wear the same type clothes (uniforms - the great equalizers) at school, go to the same church. I know why my parents went ga ga for Kennedy a few years later.

I never heard my parents say an unkind word about any other religion, ever. I did, however switch to plain ole' Christianity later on.

You know, one would have to call at least a few of the 12 Apostles Roman Catholic, to be fair.

All saints have a past, all sinners have a future. Any sinless sob's out there got any rocks I can borrow?

Freedom of religion folks. We got bigger fish to fry. Like getting the Jewish community to vote for conservatives or libertarians!

5:28 PM, September 23, 2008  
Blogger Maxine Weiss said...

http://www.jewishjournal.com/opinion/article/boys_to_men_20080702/

6:41 PM, September 23, 2008  
Blogger NJArtist said...

How did we get from Jews supporting Democrats to Roman Catholicism?

7:26 PM, September 23, 2008  
Blogger Cappy said...

I don't understand it myself. Being an MOT I don't view the Democrats and liberals as friends. It's like many of us are living in the 1960's, or even 100 years ago

9:17 PM, September 23, 2008  
Blogger Jack said...

There is no true historic memory in the Jewish mind:

Njartist,

That is incredibly ignorant. You really don't know all that much about us, do you.

1:08 AM, September 24, 2008  
Blogger Sorge said...

"As for the evangelicals, well that is a mixed bag. From a collective standpoint it is hard to feel good about people who support you because of an agenda."

Do you believe evangelicals support you because Jews needs to be in control of Israel for The Rapture to occur?

This is one of the most vicious smears I've ever heard. This particular theological belief is held by some evangelicals, but not by a majority of them--not even close. Attributing a belief held by some evangelicals to all evangelicals is vicious, and cruel.

Regardless, how do you know that is why they support you? Evangelicals support Israel for all sorts of cultural, theological and political reasons. Self-proclaimed progressives the world over, for the most part, do not support Israel at all. Many of them yearn for Israel's destruction.

Group A has some members with odd theological beliefs; group B either believes your enemies are victims, and perhaps you yourself are evil. How, how can anybody go with Group B?

4:38 AM, September 24, 2008  
Blogger kentuckyliz said...

It's not a smear if it's true.

Back to the issue - lefties are anti-Semitic in their modern expression, especially obvious in the eurolefties.

12:06 PM, September 24, 2008  
Blogger Jack said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

5:45 PM, September 24, 2008  
Blogger Jack said...

This is one of the most vicious smears I've ever heard. This particular theological belief is held by some evangelicals, but not by a majority of them--not even close. Attributing a belief held by some evangelicals to all evangelicals is vicious, and cruel.

It is not a smear or even an attempted smear. It is a combination of things based upon my experience with evangelicals. To be clear I certainly recognize that all evangelicals are not monolithic in all of their views.

But it doesn;t change the reality that Jews are targeted by them. By targeted I mean that millions of dollars are spent to help support witnessing.

Many of us find that to be the height of arrogance and offensive. It doesn't matter if it is done with good intentions. Good intentions can lead to bad results.

To reiterate I don;t think that all evangelicals are bad people. I think that the majority are good and that they are doing what we all do, just living their lives.

In the end it is just one of those things that doesn't foster trust.

5:45 PM, September 24, 2008  
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