Tuesday, August 22, 2006

Podcast on Real Food and Crunchy Cons


Today we talk with Nina Planck, author of Real Food: What to Eat and Why and Rod Dreher, author of Crunchy Cons, about what appears to some to be an oxymoron: conservatives who care about organic gardening, farmer's markets and saving the environment. We talk with both guests about how politics and food are tied together and why all Americans of different political persuasions should care about what they eat, farmer's markets and the environment.

There is also discussion of the emptiness of McMansions (mine is great--thank you very much), the irony of it costing a freaking fortune to buy an artichoke at a health food store (while the pamphlet next to the counter touts the horror of third world poverty) and how to shop for real foods on a budget.

You can listen to our podcast by clicking here or subscribe via iTunes. And there's a lo-fi version for dialup right here. You can see our past episodes at the Glenn and Helen Show.com. Comments and suggestions can be left below.

Update: Dave at the Crisper blog tells how he ate real foods to lose 51 pounds.

37 Comments:

Anonymous MaryB said...

Hi Glen and Helen,

Thanks so much for your podcast. My grandparents were farmers, so I learned early in life what real eggs and chicken and milk taste like. When they died and nobody in the family farmed any more, I unlearned it all. I got back on a real food bandwagon thanks to Adele Davis back, oh, in the 1960s I guess, then all the cholesterol and fat stuff almost got me to abandon it. Thanks for highlighting the newer research.

11:31 AM, August 22, 2006  
Blogger Pat said...

Your feed has XML errors that prevented my aggregator (Doppler Radio) from downloading it. You can see a list of the errors here:

http://feedvalidator.org/check.cgi?url=http%3A%2F%2Ffeeds.feedburner.com%2Finstapundit%2Fpodcast

I've posted comments like this on the last several podcast episodes, because the feed invariably has errors. But my comments are always ignored, and the errors are not corrected. I'm doing this in an attempt to be helpful; I like your podcast, and it seems to me that a valid feed would make it more accessible to people using a variety of aggregators. But you and Glenn don't seem interested in having listeners who use anything other than iTunes. Is that the case? If so, I will stop trying to help and go away.

If you are interested in having a valid feed, I'll be happy to help you troubleshoot it. Just let me know.

12:08 PM, August 22, 2006  
Blogger Kadnine said...

First of all, let me express how much I've been enjoying the Glenn and Helen Show! (I find myself reverting to AM talk radio speak. "First time caller, long time listener!") You guys are great, and this episode was one of the best yet.

When Rod's book came out, I was one of the hard-core right-wingers who slammed the "Crunchy Con Manifesto."

I cringe to think of it now, but at the time I asked,"I wonder how Rod squares his desire to be a steward of his fellow man with his desire to put beauty over efficiency. 'Sorry little fella, but America's Aid Package to you and your starving, third-world brothers will be a little light this month!'"

Have you and Glenn considered going to a radio call-in format? I would have loved to ask Rod if he blames America's prosperity for our culture of consumerism? Or does he credit our prosperity for allowing the leisure time to criticize consumerism?

And I would have been glad of the chance to apologize for thinking rather mean thoughts about his theories. I guess it took time *plus* the warm format of audio podcast to thaw my right-wing heart.

Sorry, Rod.

Good show, Helen and Glenn.

12:13 PM, August 22, 2006  
Blogger Cham said...

Obviously the red states have much catching up to do when it comes to healthy and environmentally friendly eating.

The burning question here is:

Why would anyone in the south be eating artichokes? First of all, artichokes might be grown in the third world but the ones in the health food store come most likely from California, (I guess if you buy foods from California you ARE supporting 3rd world countries in a round-about way) That high cost of the artichoke probably has more to do with the cost of transporting Mr. Artichoke from sunny California to Tennessee. Eating food that can't be grown outside your own region is anti-localvore, any card carrying dem lib will know that.

I'm not going to waste my time worrying about those neocon Republicans with their McMansions, their material possessions, their bad eating habits, their pear-shaped bodies and their financial problems. If anymore people try to fit themselves into my farmer's market on Sunday morning there won't be any room left for me. I just figure the conservative republicans will die faster than I will, leaving more Social Security dollars for me.

.

12:27 PM, August 22, 2006  
Blogger rastajenk said...

I wonder how many out there in AM Talk-Radio Land could be described as "longtime caller, first-time listener."

12:33 PM, August 22, 2006  
Anonymous Glenn Reynolds said...

Pat: The RSS feed is generated by a Movable Type plugin; it's automatic and there's not much we can do about that. It seems to work fine with most of the aggregators like iTunes, MyYahoo, Podcast Alley, etc. I'm sorry if it's not working with Doppler Radio. If there's a way to fix it, I'd be interested in hearing it.

12:46 PM, August 22, 2006  
Anonymous dweeb said...

There is no conflict between conservatism and caring about organic gardening, farmer's markets and saving the environment.

There is only a conflict between conservatism and depending upon government to effect organic gardening, farmer's markets and saving the environment.

1:41 PM, August 22, 2006  
Blogger Pat said...

Glenn: What Movable Type plugin generates the feed? I'll be happy to see if I can figure out what it's doing and why. If it turns out that there's a bug in Doppler, I can report that to the developer; I've corresponded with him before.

2:45 PM, August 22, 2006  
Anonymous Rob A. said...

It seemed the word most noticeably absent from Rod Dreher’s discussion (and one which remains quite important to most of the conservative coalition) was freedom. I have no problem if he wants to buy everything he consumes locally from small businesses, etc. My problem is when people de facto want to force others to make the same choice, for example by keeping “big box” stores out of areas. The argument that a Home Depot, say, will force the local hardware store out of business just proves that when push comes to shove, usually people don’t value the “mom and pop” aspect enough to counter balance the benefits they find in the larger option (be it pricing, selection, etc.). Criticism of that choice notwithstanding, it should be their choice to make.

A lot of the complaining against “big” (not just here, but in general) comes off more like a whining for “like what I like, value what I value.” In other words, as a form of argument, it is pretty unconvincing.

6:12 PM, August 22, 2006  
Anonymous Glenn Reynolds said...

Pat:

It's Brandon Fuller's MT-Enclosures plugin. Documentation is here:

http://brandon.fuller.name/archives/hacks/mtenclosures/

8:18 PM, August 22, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I think I agree with Rob A.

I knew Rod D. was a social conservative, with all the enthusiasm of a recent convert (which in fact I think he is - to the Catholic Church, not Crunchy Con-ism). But he seems to value (his) "Values" more then my freedom. I guess that makes me a libertarian like Glen and Helen.

PS - I will check when I get home, but I think the feed is not working with Juice either. My Daddy retired from IBM - I can't use Apple or I will be out of the will.

8:43 PM, August 22, 2006  
Blogger Mercurior said...

one thing that does get me, the use of organic foods, all foods are organic, hell even petrol is organic, it comes from dead plants.. plastic is organic, they mean food not produced using pesticides or additives to the soil.

5:18 AM, August 23, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I appreciate that Nina Planck is focused on buying and eating food that is (so far as possible) fresh, local, unprocessed rather than strictly organic. I often buy organic when it is tied to the production of fresh, tasty produce, but go take a look at an organic tomato from Whole Foods and tell me that that this perfect globe, imported from Chile or somesuch, is somehow intrinsically superior to conventional production. And while the organic food movement has done an excellent job educating the public on how bulk/default application of chemicals and stuffing cows with antibiotics is to be deprecated, they have not, IMO, honestly addressed the issues of worldwide malnutrition, the inefficiencies of organic vs. conventional production, and the lifesaving benefits of GMOs for 3rd world countries. Viva Nina!

10:41 AM, August 23, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Oh, and I'm glad the Rod Dreher concedes that he is more "stasist" than "dynamist" (to use Virginia Postrel's terms). No wonder he annoys the hell out of me. I live and eat much the way Rod does, but his constant jibes at materialism and "McMansions" are too smug for my taste.

10:47 AM, August 23, 2006  
Anonymous dweeb said...

I have no problem if he wants to buy everything he consumes locally from small businesses, etc. My problem is when people de facto want to force others to make the same choice,

Or subsidize that choice for them. Why should the taxpayers pay for the creation and enforcement of govt. standards for labeling food 'organic' or 'natural?' There is no good reason. We have a group of people who, because of their personal beliefs, want to be assured the food they purchase was produced in compliance with restrictions their beliefs dictate. Fine, then, let them set up a system for that, just like the one for Kosher food. The only role for government is to enforce the trademarks of that system.

2:31 PM, August 23, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Great podcast - no surprise though - a conservative, Rod Dreher, who wants to run people's lives just as much as any liberal. Yes, conservatives can be just as smug and sanctimoniouos as liberals, while they tell people what to do, at the point of a gun (the government's gun).

Liberals and conservatives can always agree that the great unwashed masses cannot be trusted to do what is right - they only disagree on some of the details. And they both agree that the government's job is to compel us to do what they want us to do.

Please re-read the Constitution and leave us to live our lives.

5:05 PM, August 23, 2006  
Anonymous Dave Johnston said...

Like I said over at my blog...this was my favorite podcast to date from you guys!

I can vouch for this approach to eating. Eat "the outside ring" at the grocery store. It's really as simple as that (although I do jump into those scary middle aisles to get some peanut butter every now and then!).

Thanks again, guys!

10:04 PM, August 23, 2006  
Anonymous Sam Muldia said...

I'll have to be the lone dissenter here. While there's nothing wrong with this "real food" per se, and the health-nut hysteria over butter and saturated fats is just that - hysteria - hawking organic produce and half-baked "what Nature meant man and woman to eat" theories are just so much technophobic crap.

Organic farming and livestock are not economically viable on a mass level, not even for the North American market. Yeah, organic beef tastes good, and hand-massaged Kobe beef is even better. But there's nothing inherently healthier about these products, and while the marbling of the beef makes it taste better, it also increases saturated fat content.

Again, there's nothing wrong with buying organic produce, there's nothing wrong with buying local farmer's crops, but to put it on a pedestal based on touchy-feely concepts of "naturalness" just furthers the agenda of the Luddite crazies who would rather see the world starve than approve of GE crops or other food-producing technologies.

The trick to dietary health is no trick at all - use common sense. Eating nothing but Doritos and Coke isn't good for you. Eating Doritos and Coke every now and then is just fine, provided you eat a balanced diet and don't sit around on your ass 24/7.

1:34 PM, August 24, 2006  
Blogger Mark Ritchie said...

This seems to get to the heart of the libertarian vs. conservative viewpoints. As hard as it is for libertarians to swallow, conservatives generally believe that there are concepts of right and wrong that are actually true, based on something besides pragmatism. Like Dr Helen's question on the podcast, "What does food have to do with morality, anyway?" That's why I can never be a true libertarian. Conservative discussion is based on the fact that there is some truth out there which can be arrived at. Everything, even economic choices, is affected by ethics.

2:29 PM, August 24, 2006  
Blogger Cham said...

Mark, the problem with that is that your version of right and wrong is probably very different from my version of right and wrong.

3:48 PM, August 24, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Mark - you are right - real libertarianism is a dead end based on nothing more than pragmatism although it comes in many flavours. It has no real moral or political underpinnings. It is not useful and detracts from real political systems that properly defend individual rights. Whether you like her or not Ayn Rand largely nailed the problems of a consistent base for a political system that respects and protects individual rights.

Objectivism has its share of nutjobs and petty squabbles, but a lot fewer than conservatives and libertarians.

And Cham, that is why you need an objective basis for morality based on the study of man's nature and the needs for human life rather than a subjective anything goes.

5:53 PM, August 24, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Sam,

You are right in that organic farming cannot sustain the earth's population. Only artificial fertilizers can, due to human overpopulation.

But you are wrong about your nutritional assessments.

1. organic local produce does have a higher nutritional value than produce that is not local and not organic.

2. grass-fed beef is not famous for that "marbling" effect. That would be grain-fed beef.

3. There are indeed many benefits of eating locally. Nutritionally of course, and environmentally. Fresher produce is of course more nutritious. Also, the amount of petrolium that is used to ship bags of lettuce across the country or blueberries across the world is rather extreme for the delivery of food items that are consumed daily.

Alison

12:52 AM, August 25, 2006  
Blogger Rizzo said...

Obviously the red states have much catching up to do when it comes to healthy and environmentally friendly eating.

Healthy eating and environmentally friendly eating are often at odds. Organic produce takes more land to grow due to lower crop yields.

And, how exactly do the red states have much catching up to do? It's the red states the grow the food in the first place. It's pretty easy to eat locally grown produce out here. There are roadside vegetable stands all over the place in the late summer and throughout the fall.

Which brings me to another point: what do you organic fetishists do when vegetables are out of season in your local market, exactly? If fresh vegetables are "of course" more nutritious than less fresh ones, what do those in the northern climes eat for about eight months out of the year? I buy from local farmer's markets when I can, but I'm not sure the food is always better, unless you consider more rotten or insect infested to be better.

Although...an insect infested tomato might actually be more nutritious than one that is not. I'm not sure I want to eat it though.

10:11 AM, August 28, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Glenn and Helen -

Loved the podcast - and wanted to follow up on your discussion with Nina about how you loved growing that one tomato plant your daughter brought home, and how into the topic she is.

It is not difficult at all to raise lots of great veggies in a small corner of your yard - and to make a vegetable and herb garden that looks great, too.

Start by looking at "Square Foot Gardening" - this was a book/TV show that streamlined and introduced many techniques for intensive gardening that have been developed by decades of organic gardeners. The method immediately creates a nicely organized garden, and you can start small and expand as you go.

In addition to vegetables, most suburbanites overlook the much easier way to eat from your backyard: plant trees and shrubs. Once they are planted and established, they require even less effort than the veggie patch.

Tree fruits and nuts are generally always more expensive than veggies, because from the farmer's perspective it's a multi-year investment that ties up their land - but all of these are advantages to the suburbanite, and many fruit and nut trees are very ornamental.

This is called "edible landscaping". You can search for many sources on the Internet using that term.

4:08 AM, August 30, 2006  
Blogger Helen said...

Anonymous 4:08:

Thanks for the suggestions.

6:40 AM, August 30, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Mark - you are right - real libertarianism is a dead end based on nothing more than pragmatism although it comes in many flavours. It has no real moral or political underpinnings. It is not useful and detracts from real political systems that properly defend individual rights.

This thread is dead by now but it should be noted that this is complete nonsense.

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11:39 PM, June 07, 2009  

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