Is Senator Obama a Rorschach Test?
Dick Meyers at CBS News has an interesting piece on voters' projections of the Democratic Candidates (Hat tip: Anchoress ). He says of Obama:
When I listen to people talk about Obama, I hear nothing but vague ideals mentioned such as "change, new ideas, something different than the mainstream, fresh voices," yada yada yada. But one thing I don't hear a lot about are his views on policy. What is his stand on Israel? How is he going to fund Universal Health care for everyone without cutting back on the quality of care and/or sacrificing research & development? If he cuts out taxes for 7 million seniors, how does this square with his belief that "everyone should pay their fair share," or does this only apply to corporations? How do you negotiate with terrorists? I have a lot more questions that I hope will be answered prior to the election, because we need more in a President than a breath of fresh air.
Sen. Obama is a Rorschach test. I see hope! I see brains! I see a whole new kind of politician! I see an amazing life story! I see an orator! I see a natural! I see a hero!
Well, real people aren't Rorschach tests. They aren't blank slates. And by January 2008, Senator Blank Slate, D-Ill., will be a messy chalkboard. He may well be a fabulous chalkboard with cool stuff all over it. But more likely, he'll be pretty much like an American politician, though perhaps one who is a great guy, with a big brain and a powerful voice.
When I listen to people talk about Obama, I hear nothing but vague ideals mentioned such as "change, new ideas, something different than the mainstream, fresh voices," yada yada yada. But one thing I don't hear a lot about are his views on policy. What is his stand on Israel? How is he going to fund Universal Health care for everyone without cutting back on the quality of care and/or sacrificing research & development? If he cuts out taxes for 7 million seniors, how does this square with his belief that "everyone should pay their fair share," or does this only apply to corporations? How do you negotiate with terrorists? I have a lot more questions that I hope will be answered prior to the election, because we need more in a President than a breath of fresh air.
Labels: politics
posted by Helen at 11:54 AM
54 Comments:
Excellent point Dr. Helen. And, given the tackiness of this current overly long election cycle, I suspect we got better quality candidates when the "breath of fresh air" was the "smoke-filled back room."
I'd rather have an overly long election cycle where candidates can eventually be vetted by being worn down rather than some smoky back room deal that results in a quickie campaign of vagueness.
This is what I like about you and your husband, the instahusband; you both have a lot of common sense.
Senator Obama sounds like he is running for Tooth Fairy or Easter Bunny, not President.
Obama is an empty suit. He will implode under scrutiny, there is no substance beneath the surface. I bet he doesn't know where he stands on anything, other than getting elected. What a loser. Actually... I guess you have to be an even bigger loser to actually vote for him.
Its amazing that the Democratic party hasn't found a single adult, who stands for anything, to rally around. Obama/ Hillary/ Edwards - each more pathetic than the other, and without any meaningful experience either. Truly bizzare.
Dr. H - you have a good head on your shoulders. To be honest, I wish that didn't make you above average - i.e. I'm surprised more people don't share your opinion on O, it seems so obvious that he has BSed his way through life, and possibly into the WH.
This is a repeating phenomenon in American politics, the "new guy" syndrome. The variable is how long before the media decides it's time for a good takedown. With Obama, that may be "never."
As far as I'm concerned, Obama's overriding virtue is that he's not Hillary Clinton. He's already said things concerning foreign policy that give me the shivers, and I have to extrapolate his domestic agenda from that (given that he's not forthcoming on details).
But that's true of all of them, and I'm weary with the hype already.
I agree with soho and rebeccah. Obama doesn't have much substance but he is pleasant, has a sense of humor and isn't Hillary Clinton. Why can't the Dems come up with any better candidates? They all scare me. I consider Thompson, McCain, and Romney better choices than any of the Dems.
If you guys are really interested in candidates who believe in Tooth Fairies, try Hucklebee. He calls the Tooth Fairy on a regular basis to get instructions.
Helen, last February I proposed an alternative logo for him based on exactly the same premise. Maybe I should have cafepressed it!
Back when my daughter was a teenager, she would change clothes two or three times a day. I would ask her why she changed. Was she going running? Was she going out to dinner? And the answer was always the same "I just wanted to change." That type of attitude is prevalent in our nation. Don't like what on TV, change channels. Don't like your spouse, change spouses. What I see in the Obama campaign as a whole and the others generally, is change just for the sake of change. Change without a specific reason of goal is a waste of money, time and energy. Change without goals means that good programs are scrapped with bad ones simply for the appearance of change. If our nation gets suckered into this type of political mentality, four years down the road, the political pendulum will swing just as radically the opposite way. BTW, both parties are going to end up in a floor fight and a brokered convention. If you people want to make an impact, start getting active in your precinct primaries. The change has to come from within. And I don't want extremists on either end calling the shots.
Ellen wrote:
"And I don't want extremists on either end calling the shots."
The problem I have with Obama is that when you look at the substance of his policies, he's neither more nor less extremist than Edwards, Pelosi et al, but he sells himself as some kind of moderate, compromising conciliator, a tone impossilbe to square with his substance. And that's nails grating down Meyers' chalkboard for me.
EllenK said:
What I see in the Obama campaign as a whole and the others generally, is change just for the sake of change.
I sense that the desire for change is a little deeper than the superficiality posited by Ellen. Lots of people are very nervous about the economy, jobs outsourced overseas, and living one illness away from financial ruin. Couple this uncertainty about the economy with a Great War on Terror that has gone on for years and seems to have no end, and it is not surprising that the polls indicate increasing numbers of Americans who say the nation is "not going in the right direction".
I have listened to his speeches, but beyond the warm fuzzy language, what is there?
While he may be a nice guy to have over for dinner, I'm afraid the career politicians in Congress and the more ruthless leaders around the world would eat this guy's lunch.
To me Obama presents himself as the Great Black Hope™, with this Manifest Destiny view that "it's time for a woman/minority/illegal alien/golden retriever/whatever to be President." And what Obama projects is an articulate non-threatening image that wants people to be comfortable with him.
Or as he would be described in A Hard Day's Night: "He's very clean." (Hey was it Richardson or Biden who made that comment?)
Anyway, my point is he looks good, sounds good, but he doesn't have to say anything specific because he's running as the Anti-Bush with the aforementioned minority/woman president theme.
Myself, I'm torn between Romney and Huckabee/Thompson. Or I would take a Romney-Huckabee ticket. Or JC Watts if he ever ran for president. Because Clinton/Obama/Edwards policy scare me.
It should be remembered that Obama didn't win election as a senator because he ran a brilliant, engaging campaign, but because his opponent, Jack Ryan, went through a messy divorce and custody proceedings. When the custody proceedings were revealed, against the wishes of both Jack and Jeri Ryan, Jack Ryan was eventually forced to withdraw. So basically Obama has won election to State office on his own, and National office through the misfortune of his opponent.
Not a very good or encouraging electoral record. I mean how many adulterous politician are there? Okay, how many adulterous politicians have wives as beautiful as Jeri Ryan?
I agree with soho. Here's a man who has BS'ed his way through life. When he bloviates, oops, speaks, and talks about "doing the hard work" I actually feel the revulsion viscerally, like I'm cleaning up my dog's puke and get a big unintentional whiff. Please pardon the image; one of our dogs is sick and that's what happened to me this morning, and it felt about the same as listening to Obama speak.
However, Romney's claim to business fame is that he has been a management consultant. I've worked in the field myself. BS using charts, graphs and PowerPoint doesn't make me feel much better than BS orations do. Of course, Romney isn't a thinly-veiled socialist, so I'd prefer him to Obama if I had to hold my nose and vote today. That's a pretty sad endorsement.
Can an agnostic still pray for the country? That's what I feel like doing...
Obama also has an advantage in that he's neither Jesse Jackson nor Al Sharpton. I don't want to vote for him, but given how I feel about Clinton, Edwards, Guilini, McCain, and Huckabee, I can't be too negative on the guy. He's solid 50th percentile when it comes to 2008 Presidential candidates.
You seem to think the beef is in the policies. I think that's wrong. Policies are a dime a dozen. As President you have access to zillions of experts who can easily come up with wise policies. What experts can't do, is deliver on those policies. For that you need someone with the charisma to get elected and inspire, someone with the intelligence and sensitivity to convince or outmaneuver political opponents, and of course someone with the honesty and integrity to obtain trust and then retain it.
To a good approximation, the democratic candidates all have the same policy ideas. The difference is that Obama can inspire the nation, while Clinton has as much charisma as a doormat. With the same policy ideas Obama can lead America and the world to great things, while Clinton never will.
Sen. Obama is a Rorschach test. I see hope! I see brains! I see a whole new kind of politician! I see an amazing life story! I see an orator! I see a natural! I see a hero!
I see cotton candy.
The thing is, all the frontrunner Dems are running as NotBush, with the ultimate irony of Hillary! giving her Iowa NonVictory speech about "change" with Madeline Albright, Bill Clinton, Wesley Clark and a bunch of other blue hair Clintonoids and sixties hasbeen liberals all on the Stage with her.
That ain't change. That's more of the same crap from 16 years ago.
I have a lot more questions that I hope will be answered prior to the election, because we need more in a President than a breath of fresh air.
The other thing is the ideas being touted as "fresh and new change!" are moldy 20th century leftism and socialism which have been monumental failures wherever they are employed. It is the classic definition of insanity: doing the same things over and over expecting a different result.
Sarah,
I really have a hard time comparing Obambi as a person with Giuliani or McCain or even Huckabee. Edwards and Clinton I can see.
If you don't know what Obama's views and proposals are, that's your fault, not his. For instance, he has this thing called a "Web site" where such information is posted. For free! Start there.
Guy's comment presents a perfect example of the sort of voter I would guess supports Obama. Take that for whatever you think of it, I guess.
For those of us who look for fact and substance, Obama is an empty suit.
For others, Obama is a Disney mirror, sanctioning their inarticulate, inconsistent, whimsical, "warm-and-fuzzy" beliefs as being "the fairest of them all."
Guy said: With the same policy ideas Obama can lead America and the world to great things, while Clinton never will.
Sorry, but socialism sold softly by a pretty face is just as unappealing as socialism offered up via a hard sell con job by a spent 1960s leftist.
I've listened to Obama's speeches and all I get is "empty suit that sounds nice."
Obama reminds me of a state senator I know.
He looks good, has the beautiful wife and the cute baby, but God help you if you need anything done because he won't or can't get it accomplished. He is an empty suit who manages to dodge every tough issue during legislative sessions and everyone knows it.
Obama and my senator are cut from the same cloth, and I find nothing inspirational about it.
Barry and Dogwood, Obama has actually achieved a lot as a legislator in Illinois. He is no empty suit. Hillary played with higher stakes, but what did she actually achieve, apart from destroying all hope for healthcare reform during her husband's administration?
Interesting op-ed piece.
This source of opposition to his bill doesn't pass the "smell test", though I'm not a student of Illinois politics. I'm disinclined to believe that people who oppose executions would oppose reforms designed to protect the innocent from prosecution and conviction.
"There were death penalty abolitionists, some of whom worried that Obama's bill, by preventing the execution of innocents, would deprive them of their best argument."
That said, a thorough read of the op-ed piece says that Obama introduced and succeeded in getting passed one bill in Illinois, and co-authored one in DC. His greatest asset was identified as schmoozing.
Now, schmoozing is an important part of politics, but that hardly negates anything I said about him BS'ing his way through life.
And I should clarify: an "accomplishment" to me ought to be something beyond politics, and a negotiator is not necessarily a leader. I'd hire Obama to negotiate for me any day of the week.
Also, I never compared him to Hillary or Edwards. "This cheap beer tastes a LOT better than battery acid!" isn't really meaningful, either.
I, too, am sick of hearing Washington suits, or "wannabees," talk about the "need for change," when as someone said, above, rarely do we actually get the needed change. "Change" is campaign rhetoric, only, used in the fervent hope of being elected, in order to go back to doing business as usual.
Exactly, Dr. Helen.
Obama does have charisma (which is in part due to his intelligence). And I feel its pull strongly. But that's nowhere near enough for me to vote for him, at least since I'm a Republican.
However, I live in Illinois, which will go Democratic even without the "native son" aspect, so my vote's academic.
Perhaps Obama's greatest strength (besides his appearance and speaking skills) is his lack of experience. You can dig up plenty of dirt and inconsistencies on Rudy and Hillary and Romney and just about any politician who has had to appeal to conflicting constituencies. Obama is a tabula rosa that no one has had a chance to plaster with posters and graffiti.
Obama reminds me of a certain kind of person one sometimes encounters in business: the guy who is always talking about "passion" and "excellence" but isn't too sure what products his company sells or what the issues facing it might be.
Romney reminds me of another kind of business person: the one who is so obsessed with "process" that the purpose of the process is forgotten.
I heard recent polls are showing him ahead in New Hampshire so he could very well win the Democratic nominee.
Simon - I see you changed his name to Bambi, but what is the picture of?
Gringo - Jesus and the Tooth Fairy are very different and the top three Democratic candidates are all Christians, so why doesn't that bother you? It is acceptable for Democrats to preach politics in churches, but not Republicans.
Soho: Its amazing that the Democratic party hasn't found a single adult, who stands for anything, to rally around. Obama/ Hillary/ Edwards - each more pathetic than the other, and without any meaningful experience either. Truly bizzare.
I imagine Obama's appeal is that he is partially black; Hillary because she is a woman and wife of Bill Clinton; as far as Edwards goes I'm not really sure.
Major - It was Biden and wasn't he also the same guy that Clarence Thomas said was very racist in his book? Huckabee and Romney don't really appeal to me, but I'll take Giuliani, Thompson, McCain or Hunter.
I don't get it, Obama goes on 60 Minutes earlier this year and talks about Israel. A google search of "obama israel policy" produces 1.4 million returns, and Helen demagogues Obama for not having an Israel policy? Same with health care and other issues you listed. Doesn't your google work or do you just like to demogogue people who you see as a political threat?
I know it must be threatening to see someone so young and bright and committed to transparent government after years of supporting a secretive fear mongering, incompetent and corrupt administration run by a president who speaks with 4th grade level grammar.
Ellen,
I have read his views on Israel, I am still left confused. e.g. he gives a nice speech such as the one at AIPAC but many of his supporters such as George Soros and Jimmy Carter are anti-Israel and tend to be anti-semetic. With Obama's very liberal voting record so far, I am concerned about his Israel stance. So forgive me if I have a few questions I would like answered about his policies--for even after reading, I find his answers very vague. And what if I do have more questions for a presidential candidate--isn't that what informed citizens do, ask questions?
It seems that you are the one who feels threatened, why else would you feel the need to stop by here with your insults? A more secure person could have made their point without the accusations.
"My view is that the United States' special relationship with Israel obligates us to be helpful to them in the search for credible partners with whom they can make peace, while also supporting Israel in defending itself against enemies sworn to its destruction."
-- Senator Obama
You right, I am threatened by a leadership that has made the US (and Israel) hated in the world to an unprecedented degree, and created more terrorism than any previous leadership, particularly in Israel's neighborhood.
You right, I am threatened by a leadership that has made the US (and Israel) hated in the world to an unprecedented degree, and created more terrorism than any previous leadership, particularly in Israel's neighborhood.
Are you talking about BJ Clinton or W? Because if you think that the PA or Hamas are interested in anything but the destruction of Israel, you are very very naive. The whole "Bush created more terrorists" meme is a very ignorant statement and completely lets the radical Muslims who control Palestine off the hook. The Palestinians are not victims. They are aggressors who we have excused and ignored for far too long.
Ellen,
They hated us before W was elected, they hated us after W was elected, and they will continue to hate us if Obama is elected.
If you believe an Obama presidency will usher in world peace and kumbaya feelings toward the U.S., then you are being incredibly naive.
If Obama is elected, third world thugs and terrorists will dine on Obama's lunch daily. He simply is not up to the task, at least not yet. Perhaps someday, but not in 2008.
Sgt Ted, here's a dose of reality: A 2006 poll sponsored by the BBC found that in 33 of the 35 countries surveyed the most common opinion was that the war in Iraq has increased the threat of terrorism. On average 60 percent had this view, while 12 percent thought it had decreased the threat. The 35 countries represented a sampling of five continents and the Middle East.
The Bush administration has viewed Iraq as pivotal to democratic transition in the region, hoping that it would serve as a positive example of democratization. Instead, nations in the region have come to see it as a negative example. This is confirmed by polls conducted during 2004 and 2005 by the University of Maryland and Zogby International in Jordan, Lebanon, Morocco, Saudi Arabia, Egypt, and the UAE.
Radical Islamic parties have increased their political influence substantially in more than a dozen nations, often campaigning explicitly against what they describe as a "war against Islam" by the US. Winning more votes during the past five years than ever before, such parties have advanced their positions in Bahrain, Egypt, Kuwait, Indonesia, Jordan, Morocco, the Palestinian territories, Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, and Turkey.
In Turkey and the Palestinian territories they now lead governments and probably could win power in Egypt, too, should fully free elections be conducted there.
Thank you GW Bush!
Yes, this is what the US needs, more fear, more militarism, more war, more hate, and a growing reputation as a world pariah. Is this the direction you want the US to continue on?
Pew Research:
Among allied nations: pro-US sentiments plummet
Polls conducted by the Pew Research Center show a precipitous decline in positive attitudes about the United States since the year 2000 in eight of 12 countries for which multi-year comparisons can be made. According to the Pew polls, the proportion of the population feeling positively toward the United States has plummeted in Great Britain from 83 percent to 56, in France from 62 percent to 39, in Germany from 78 percent to 37, and in Spain from 50 percent to 23. Japan, too, has seen a decline.
Among Muslim populations: Fear and disapproval grow
The steepest declines found by the Pew polls, however, occurred in Indonesia, Jordan, and Turkey -- all three notable as moderate or democratic Muslim-majority states. Positive attitudes toward the United States are shared by only 30 percent of Indonesians and 15 percent or less of Jordanians and Turks.
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Good point Helen. I think very much the same thing about Obama and wrote about it on my blog.
http://anothergunblog.blogspot.com/2008/01/candidates-of-change.html
By the way. To address a comment I saw. Bush didn't make the terrorists hate us. They've hated us for years and will continue to hate us for years to come. They've hated us and have been bombing our embassies and killing American's since before I was born.
Great site! Excellent insightful comments about Senator Obama. The proverbial "inconvenient truths" about who he is, or who he is not....and about his vague political notions. It's discouraging to see how many Americans are supporting him. What they are supporting, exactly, is not clear. A nice smile, a good communicator (of little substance), a nice face...sure, but substance? None there... NONE! He wasn't elected, he has done little to review, he's got questionable history and ties and connections (Al Sharpton says it best, "people of color coalitions" that expect his allegiance and support, should he be elected,...apparently simply due to his "color". Hmmm??? ) It's not a pretty picture out there! We need to be a people / electorate with principals. We need to be an electorate with standards we are unwilling to put aside. We need to demand more detailed answers from any / all candidates and EXPECT follow through when they are elected. We need far more than simply a nice looking, well spoken Junior Senator speaking nice sounding messages of "change"....to represent us, the United States of American.
One thing I have to say is I am terrified!
Bin Laden promised he'd get us and he will, if the junior senator from Ill is President.
There are many different dates in his timeline for senator, different sources quote different times and years. He quickly rose to his current status from 1996 to 2008, approx 12 years. Most of this time we were/are dealing with terrorism, 2001 culminating in 9/11. Does anyone see a connection here besides me?
I can see police states, gov't run shops and grocery stores with limited selections, federally gov't run schools and the taking down of all churches and synagogues, socialist medicine without benefit of trained doctors. gov't run television and radio. Freedom? What will that mean? According to Obama it's just a word. Good-bye books, travel, First Amendment, movies, music, internet, cell phones, and blogs such as this.
Do you think he'll make it through his first 180 days? Too many crazies out there.
Ellen
For goodness sakes, don't believe everything BBC says! First I don't like the current administration, don't like the war and have a son in the middle of it. But, this stance has kept terrorism out of the US since 2001 as far as we know.
Obama has no set policy on Israel. The evening before his victory dance, he said we should help Israel, the next day, he changed his mind. You should listen to a good news station rather than BBC or Fox once in awhile. Try your local NBC or CBS or even ABC affiliate. You may hear some, and I repeat, SOME, truth.
We will be in big trouble if he gets to the WH. He plans to meet with terrorists, because he probably IS one.
We're already in trouble, and if Mcain gets in the White House, there will be double trouble. How do you figure Obama's a terrorist? What if Mcain's a Klu Klux Klans man? Mcain does not represent the average American. If you've ever struggled, know someone who is struggling, know someone who's HIV positive, just got laid off, upset with the gas prices, know someone who needs health care, your child was killed in Iraq, possess one or two degrees with a rather good job, but it still is'nt enough, approaching retirement, but can't afford to retire; if you know someone who's going through these things, wake up! Mcain is not what's up! These things doesn't just happen to a small group of people. It's happening to white, black, green, purple, and red. We need someone who understand's reality. Mcain has 7 homes, that's not reality. I feel like Iraq will be dealt with, decent and in order, the way it should be, once Obama takes over. Oh! Yes, he will make it through his 180 days, through God all things are possible.
Keep blogging.
Good luck.
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