Interview on Men's Issues
Bernard Chapin, author of Women: Theory and Practice and Escape from Gangsta Island: A School's Progressive Decline
has an interview up with me at Men's News Daily entitled The Apex Fallacy:
Go read the whole thing and pay attention to my answers to the questions on chivalry, they are worth noting.
has an interview up with me at Men's News Daily entitled The Apex Fallacy:I have conducted scores of interviews since 2003, but rarely did one alter my worldview. Yet that was precisely what occurred during my exchange with Dr. Helen Smith. Her answer to my second question led to my coming up with a new term for the fallacious way by which feminists comprehend the nature of our social structure. The phrase “Apex Fallacy” sprung to mind as it elucidates fully the inaccurate fashion by which they assess the status of women in America.
Go read the whole thing and pay attention to my answers to the questions on chivalry, they are worth noting.
Labels: men's issues
posted by Helen at 8:33 AM
17 Comments:
I was surprised to see the name of Roy Baumeister. He's one of my favorite researchers, along with his colleague, Diane L. Tice. Their work on self-regulation is amazing.
Very interesting questions by the interviewer. The "Top and Bottom" question was particularly insightful. Dr Helen, you made excellent points in your responses.
I thought your comment about the advertising was off base. Just because the actor in a commercial (about bed wetting, then drugs) was male doesn't indicate an indictment of the gender. The actor has to be someone. Too small a sample. I've seen plenty of drug commercials with girls.
Your comments on chivalry (and his question as well) were also skewed, in my view. Chivalry is a code of honor, not "how you treat women". Part of ancient chivalry defined behavior of men towards women but the majority of that code of honor had to do with how you comport your self in battle, among your peers and among the peasantry. I feel that "modern chivalry" has more to do with how you respect and expect respect from your peers (that's everybody in our society) and it has no gender application. Man, Woman, Whatever. As an honorable person, you respect yourself, command respect from others and give respect to others (in that order of you're doing it right).
To Helen:
Let me throw a highly evolutionary spin on your interview. You state that the big problem is that men won't fight with women. However, men don't get laid by a women that they fight with, so fighting with woman is usually a losing strategy or a personal level. In terms of evolutionary psychology, this is stated as "Women are choosers, men are chosen". Note that the behavioral bias doesn't have to be conscious. It can be expressed solely as in emotional terms.
Moreover, when confronted by a legal system that is highly biased toward women, especially when it comes to paternity fraud in married couples, men are (or should be) very reluctant enter into close, long term relationships, particularly one ending in marriage.
In other words, if men are "emotionally distant", as women complain, more often than not, it's because of female behavior. Most women simply are not interested in listening to men's viewpoints.
Dr. Helen
“…treating them (boys) with more respect and give them more responsibility, not less, we would see more respectful and responsible behavior…”
I could regale anyone who would listen with story after story of one of the nuns who had charge of me for two years of my elementary education. Suffice it to say that I hated her as she seemed always to be picking on the boys in general and me specifically. It wasn’t until years later that it came to me what a wonderful woman and teacher she was. Along with the incessant harangues and lectures aimed at the boys came delegation of authority and responsibility (patrol boys, i.e. safety crossing guards, care of school and church property, altar boy service, et al). These positions were delegated, for the most part. Parents were sufficiently trusting of the nuns, so much so that when a nun “volunteered” a boy’s services there was rarely a complaint (I’d never heard of any). Sister Mary X new more about boys and how to handle them then most all the professional educators and Ritalin pushers of today. Keep them busy, give them responsibilities, give them authority – boys love that kind of stuff – it tends to puff out the chest and gives them a sense of worth. Don’t take my word on it, take Sister Mary X’s.
Chivalry...most men in the western world have at least some sense of chivalry, in that they understand that with power goes responsibility and if a person is knocked down, you help him get up, or at least refrain from kicking him. I think that chivalry, in this broad sense, is less common among women, who are likely to assume that if a person got knocked down, he deserved it. (I'm talking about personal behavior, not political theories.) I'm not sure to what extent this is due to upbringing--men were expected to be the wielders of power, so were given some training in how to wield it responsibly, whereas ethical trainig for women has centered mainly on sexual matters--or is something inborn.
It is worth noting that in many tribal societies, the duty of torturing prisoners is assigned to women.
bobh --
There are plenty of women who desire fights and indeed have sex afterward. A lot of them push it to that point on purpose. Mind you, I don't at all think it's 'normal' or sane.
Me? I walk off from a gal who wants continual strife. Ain't worth the stomach aches.
bobh --
There are plenty of women who desire fights and indeed have sex afterward. A lot of them push it to that point on purpose. Mind you, I don't at all think it's 'normal' or sane.
Me? I walk off from a gal who wants continual strife. Ain't worth the stomach aches.
Sorry for double. Line problems.
Dr Helen,
Thanks for posting your interview with Mr. Chapin.
Regarding the commercials showing a bed-wetting and a drug-using boy, yes, the sample was small, but it remains representative. By and large, if the subject of the advert is negative or a problem, it is more likely to be portrayed by a male.
I also disagree further with HMT on chivalry. It was not sex-neutral...yes, most of it was about battlefield conduct, but it also prescribed complementary roles that men and women were to play. That role was set aside for women with the advent of political equality (and then some), yet some still try to apply it to men, with disastrous consequences.
George wrote:
"Keep them busy, give them responsibilities, give them authority – boys love that kind of stuff – it tends to puff out the chest and gives them a sense of worth."
A good point about raising boys. Treat them like men that they will become and surprise! that's what they'll turn out to be.
George's experience with sisters (nuns, strictly speaking, are sisters who are cloistered) in school corresponds perfectly with mine. They understood that boys and girls will behave differently, and that there's no changing that. They were also quite fair. I'm not saying that they never made mistakes, but they were fair given what they saw.
And I salute our host for having the perspicacity and courage to state that our society is, as a whole, extremely hostile to men. I've been a bachelor for fifty-six years, and I fully expect to be a bachelor for the rest of my life. The risks of marriage are simply too great.
"I've been a bachelor for fifty-six years, and I fully expect to be a bachelor for the rest of my life. The risks of marriage are simply too great."
I hope that choice has made you happy James. I think it's a shame that our society vilifies men and women who don't want to get married and start churning out kids. I've done both (married with kids). Our other M/wK friends always want to know what's wrong with our single friends (nothing, they're just single) and if our married no-kid friends are looking into fertility treatments (no, they may well be fertile but don't want kids, EVER).
BC asked HS about misandry.
Readers, fire up MS Word and type in "misandry." It is flagged as a misspelled word. (Of course, misogyny is in its dictionary.)
"I've been a bachelor for fifty-six years, and I fully expect to be a bachelor for the rest of my life. The risks of marriage are simply too great."
I hope that choice has made you happy James. I think it's a shame that our society vilifies men and women who don't want to get married and start churning out kids.
I don't know for sure whether it's made me happy, but I think that I would have been less happy had I married any of the women whom I've dated. Fortunately, it's okay where I live (Silicon Valley) to be a life-long bachelor. It isn't that way in some other parts of the country where I've lived.
Chivalry initially was about survival of the species, in some sense.
A lot of how we act and what we do is based on evolution of which survival of the species is the driving force. The differences between males and females, of all species that have sexual differentiation, are biologically innate.
Feminists and many others want to deny this biological difference. Trying to force kids, i.e. boys, to go against their biological wiring and punishing them for behaving according to their innate biology is quite harmful.
The sisters (nuns) recognized and accepted this biology and pointed it in positive directions. I was schooled by the Sisters of Mercy my first 7 years and have largely good memories. My older sister, who was schooled by sisters for 12 years, liked it so much she sent her daughter to an all girls Catholic school.
I love the "Apex Fallacy" term. It concisely describes the lopsided "logic" of many feminists.
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