Tuesday, August 26, 2008

Getting Stronger

If you can treat personal tragedy like a heavy set of 20 squats, you'll do better than someone who has never met any challenge.--Mark Rippetoe


Now that my health is somewhat better, I have been working out more--mainly with light weights, aerobics and Kra Maga once a week. I wanted to take it up a notch so I decided to read up on some tips for strength training more effectively. I was delighted that Glenn received two books by Mark Rippetoe recently in the mail: Strong Enough? Thoughts from Thirty Years of Barbell Training and Starting Strength. I used to weight train religiously in my twenties up until my thirties when I had my heart attack. I am taking it slow but I still love reading about weight training. If you do, you might also enjoy Rippetoe's books.

I picked up the "Strong Enough" book because it looked like it had some good advice. Rippetoe explains that the squat, press, deadlift and bench press have been used by the strongest athletes on the planet:

There is a reason for that. Any program that doesn't use them is inferior to one that does, and an athlete that leaves them out of the program is doing less than possible for performance, and less than absolutely necessary to have the best strength possible.


He describes each exercise in separate sections and gives some pictures and details about how to do each one correctly. Interestedly, Rippetoe does not believe that full squats are bad for the knees and thinks that doctors and physical therapists who warn people against them just do not know how to do a squat properly:

What generally happens is that when one of these professionals explains why you will die if you do squats, he will demonstrate with squat technique so incorrect that even unweighted, it hurts to watch, and then he'll say SEE, THERE, SQUATS ARE BAD FOR YOUR KNEES. This is like saying that if you burn the beans, they stink up the house, so you shouldn't eat beans. You don't get to define the argument in terms that prove you're right, and then charge money because you won the argument.


Apparently, this guy has never been in academia. But that's beside the point. I have often heard that full squats are bad for one's knees but they seem to be the best exercise for me as they really work the back of the legs and glutes. I sometimes do them with no or little weight. Anyway, the rest of the book is good with sections on biomechanics, good form, and "being very alive" in which he makes fun of the term "wellness." Why? "Wellness means having a salad and baked potato after your aerobics class." Rippetoe believes exercise should be mentally and physically challenging. While I concur, I must say that after experiencing what it is to be very ill, I am pretty happy with a baked potato and aerobics class but then, maybe I'm not his target audience.

If you are, check out his books, they are inspirational.

Labels:

28 Comments:

Blogger lovemelikeareptile said...

The squat can be a very dangerous exercise if you are using substantial weight. Any misalignment and back injuries can result. I was never good at it and blew out my abdomen doing them incorrectly (hernia).
Its true that it is great for an athlete, because it mimics natural movements, as the leg extension and leg curl do not-- but a safer exercise is the leg press. Sitting and pressing forward is Ok, but pressing up is the best ( either straight up or at an angle) and no huge weight is lying on your spine.

Tall people are especially at risk I have noticed in the squat-- a mechanical thing , no doubt.

The military press is best done sitting-- as it causes back strain, as does the standing barbell curl.

Typically people never discover they are prone to a back injury until it occurs, so its a good idea to play it safe.


Its easy to injure your back lifting weights, and when you do-- there is no going back from that injury.

3:48 PM, August 26, 2008  
Blogger Peregrine John said...

Apparently, this guy has never been in academia.

From my position, very close indeed to one of the largest examples of academia and all that comes with it, this was absolutely freaking hilarious. Fortunately, everyone else is off at lunch, or I'd have to explain the heresy behind my laughter...

4:00 PM, August 26, 2008  
Blogger Danny said...

lovemelikeareptile: I agree with you somewhat. Squats can be dangerous if one is trying to lift a lot more weight than one's body can handle. However, if you build yo your core strength,and dont try to out-lift the steroid-fueled monsters in the gym, squats are a great exercise. Of course, correct form, and a spotter are essential too.

Helen- I am trying to get back in shape, trying to force my body to heal itself after 12 years ruined by brain cancer, a heart attack, and other health issues caused by chemotherapy and the other medications.
Hopefully, I will be able to complete a half-marathon next fall :):)
Best of luck to you.

I 'd get those 2 books too, but, I am dead-assed broke !!:):):)

5:23 PM, August 26, 2008  
Blogger lovemelikeareptile said...

Yeah-- I checked those two out-- look pretty good. But just the basic movements-- looks to be for a powerlifter primarily. Sure got rave reviews

The squat is the king of leg and butt developers, no doubt about that... many people find that lunges holding dumbells are good also. Thats a brutal exercise, though.

Lifting free weights is not a risk-free activity. The machines are much safer, but they are not as effective, IMO. Anyone who has been in gyms for many years-- even the "meathead" variety-- has seen his share of mishaps.

And the old bodybuilding books-- like Arnold's "Education of a Bodybuilder "from 1977--- often had a lot of bad techniques and advice that everyone copied then.

5:41 PM, August 26, 2008  
Blogger Jeff Y. said...

He's completely correct about full squats. They are in fact safer than parallel squats. Think about it. The point of maximum leverage on the knee joint is at 90 degrees. When you reverse the movement there, you doing a plyometric stretch at the point of maximum instability. But in a full squat, your hips take the ploymetric stretch.

I'm 43, and I've been doing Olympic-style weight lifting for over a decade, including heavy full squats. It's kept my knees and hips and back healthy.

I do Crossfit and Parkour. The Parkour guys give me a ration of shit for being the old man. Oh well.

I highly recommend both for functional fitness. Of course, I wrestle and box too.

And it's all fun!

11:36 PM, August 26, 2008  
Blogger Mateo G said...

Go to T-nation.com and learn the proper squat technique from the dozens of free articles and videos. Most people hurt themselves because they do not have proper form. Also, they don't check the ego at the door and slam a bunch of plates on the bar.

Ever see a baby fold his or her legs and then plop down between them? You don't squat on top of your legs, but inbetween.

Squats, rows, pull ups, deadlifts and dumbell bench press should be 90% of your weight training. I do squats and deads with no belt or gloves and have been for years, with proper form, proper (and slowly increasing) weight, and correct rest.

All other exercises are for shoring up inbalances if your goal is visual (curls and such). Cardio is good and you should do that on days you don't lift. Avoid magazine quick fix workouts.

Eat properly, 5 or 6 times a day, and get tons of sleep. You'll feel like a new person in just a few weeks.

8:00 AM, August 27, 2008  
Blogger Mateo G said...

Here is an excerpt from the interview with Mark Rippetoe, the author of "Starting Strength", on t-nation:
http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_article/sports_body_training_performance/starting_strength

"A squat is the full range of motion exercise that involves you lowering a bar held on your body eccentrically, and then raising it up after your femurs have broken the plane of parallel to the ground. That's the squat.

And you can do that wrong or you can do that right. But you don't get to do it high and call it a "squat" or call it "bad for the knees." You don't teach little kids how to do these exercises incorrectly, and then come back and say that the problems caused by doing them incorrectly are the fault of barbell training.

Furthermore, they're not strong enough to use enough weight to hurt themselves, which is one real good argument against quarter squats. You can lift big weights in quarter squats. But if you have to go all the way down below parallel, and stand all the way back up with the weight, you're not going to be able to do it until you get really strong. That goes for adults and children."

8:42 AM, August 27, 2008  
Blogger Mateo G said...

Here is an excerpt from the interview with Mark Rippetoe, the author of "Starting Strength", on t-nation:
http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_article/sports_body_training_performance/starting_strength

"A squat is the full range of motion exercise that involves you lowering a bar held on your body eccentrically, and then raising it up after your femurs have broken the plane of parallel to the ground. That's the squat.

And you can do that wrong or you can do that right. But you don't get to do it high and call it a "squat" or call it "bad for the knees." You don't teach little kids how to do these exercises incorrectly, and then come back and say that the problems caused by doing them incorrectly are the fault of barbell training.

Furthermore, they're not strong enough to use enough weight to hurt themselves, which is one real good argument against quarter squats. You can lift big weights in quarter squats. But if you have to go all the way down below parallel, and stand all the way back up with the weight, you're not going to be able to do it until you get really strong. That goes for adults and children."

8:42 AM, August 27, 2008  
Blogger Danny said...

Randall Strossen( sp?) at www.ironmind.com has a great site will all kinds of good training books, some gear too.

Jeff Y. would you contact me backchannel? I'd like to ask you a couple of questions about Olympic weightlifting. Lookslike not a single gym here in my town has lifting platforms or the Olympic barbells or plates. In fact I asked one of the "trainers" at the gold's Gym,and he didnt know what "Olympic weightlifting" was!!! :):):)

9:10 AM, August 27, 2008  
Blogger Physics Geek said...

Dr. Helen,

I'd like to suggest that you check out some of the bodyweight programs for getting strong, if for no other reason than to provide a change of pace in your workout. The workouts found here are very good. However, I would caution you about the isometric exercises. They tend to raise the blood pressure a little, which is contraindicated for a heart attack survivor. Everything else, though, will definitely get you strong.

9:29 AM, August 27, 2008  
Blogger DADvocate said...

I recommend extreme caution with squats. Last spring my 15 year old son suffer an avulsion fracture of his pelvis doing squats. That means his hamstring muscle literally pulled a piece of bone off of the pelvis. He still isn't 100% healed but should be soon and should not suffer any permanent problems.

From what I've been told and read, younger people's muscle to bone connections are not fully matured and heavy lifting in the squat like my son was doing should be avoided.

I do think that exercise has mental benefits as well as physical ones.

10:27 AM, August 27, 2008  
Blogger Jack said...

I found a long time ago that I could use push ups, dips, curls, crunches and a couple of other exercises to do an awful lot.

I may not be ripped like I was in my twenties, but the exercises still work well.

12:07 PM, August 27, 2008  
Blogger Helen said...

Thanks all for the tips. I realize that squats can be dangerous for some and do them with no weight or just a few pounds.

Dadvocate,

Ouch! Hope your son heals soon!

3:36 PM, August 27, 2008  
Blogger DADvocate said...

He's doing quite well. He should be able to play football in the next couple of weeks.

4:13 PM, August 27, 2008  
Blogger Jeff Y. said...

Danny, I can't access your blogger profile. That means I can't email you.

I'm unsurprised that the trainer didn't know what Olympic-style weight lifting is all about. It's hard to find gyms that have drop plates, too. But one thing I've definitely learned: there is no safe way to slowly set down heavy weight from over your head. You just have to drop it.

When I was hardcore, my strength workouts were 20 sets of 1 rep, as close to my max as possible. Today, I do 3 sets of 3 with at least ten minutes between sets. My technique and conditioning workouts are centered around high pulls, power snatches, and full-ass-to-the-heels back squats under maximal isometric tension.

You know the squats are done right when you hear the weights clink against the bottom of the bar as they try to keep accelerating after you legs are straight. The idea is train your body to accelerate throughout the movement all the way to the top. When my feet start coming off the ground, I add weight to keep me down.

It's a weight class sport, so the idea is to get as strong as possible without adding body weight. That means very low reps and very heavy weight. You really need a coach at first for safety. It's important to know how to fail a lift. If you know that, it'll be very hard for you to hurt yourself.

Sorry you're having a hard time finding a gym with drop plates. Been there done that. Sucks.

As for some of these gym "trainers": --- pffft. I was once thrown out of a gym for doing clean and jerks with less than 200 lbs. They freaked out. And they are supposed to be the experts. Insane.

10:02 PM, August 27, 2008  
Blogger Danny said...

JeffY- Thanks for yuor comment about Olympic weightlifting. You can contact me at : ldsdannyATgmail.com

And YouTube has quite a few videos posted of Mark Rippetoe training people at his Gym, where he talks them through doing a given exercise using correct form etc.

7:57 AM, August 28, 2008  
Blogger Jeff Y. said...

I've looked at "Starting Strength." It's a good book, and I've ordered it from Amazon.

I'd like to take issue with the idea the bench press, squat, and deadlift are the lifts we should use to judge an athlete's strength.

First, the lifts are done slowly. They don't test power, despite the term "power lifting."

Second, they don't test the full chain of strength from foot to hand. The bench press is shoulder to hand. The squat tests foot to shoulder. The deadlift tests foot to hand, but from the shoulder to the hand it's isometric only.

I think power lifts test just maximal strength, not power. If you want to test power, you have account for speed. One way to do this is to choose lifts that allow you to lift more weight, if you move faster.

If I'm right, then the lift that tests power and athleticism to the fullest degree is the Snatch. It tests strength from the foot to the hand, both dynamically and isometrically, showing the athlete's ability to conduct the power of the legs to the hands through the body. It doesn't get more fundamental than that. And, you have to be super fast to make the lift at heavy weights.

I think the Snatch movement is the most athletic movement in all of sports. It's a maximal strength, whole body move upwards at maximal speed, then a maximal speed duck under, then an overhead squat to a full isometric hold. That gets it all. It is the supreme test of athletic power.

1:39 PM, August 28, 2008  
Blogger Danny said...

Jeff Y. : I agree with you. I think the Snatch and the Clean&Jerk are two of thebest ways to gauge a person's functional strength.

Until the last football season, the Strength&Conditioning Coaches at the Univ f Michigan had the football team train like powerlifters. No Olympic lifts were taught or allowed. When the new coaching regime took over in January, they had a completely new Strenght&Conditioning Coaching team come in. They train in the Olympic lifts and train for functional strength and endurance. The 330+ LB lineman have all lost about 25 to 30 lbs on average, yet are claiming that they are far stronger than under the previous coach's training regime,and that they have more endurance too.

8:16 PM, August 28, 2008  
Blogger LabRat said...

I'll speak up and second Jeff Y. I fell off the wagon recently when I had way too many plates spinning at once in my life, but I used to do Crossfit, too- and I'm a sedentary nerd, not an athlete of any description. Scaled back to levels I could accomplish, the program (and its emphasis on heavy, multijoint lifts and functional strength) did INFINITELY more for me- mentally, physically, and healthwise- in less time than any machine-based program I've ever used.

I'll also provide another vote for "squats, done correctly, are not only not dangerous, they're very beneficial"- I was very careful about form and safety (I have a power cage, so if I lift proves too much for me, I can literally "drop out" and save my back), and after full squats had become a regular part of my life, the chronic weakness and instability in my right ankle I'd had since two lateral ligament tears years ago... went away. The right is as strong as the left, now.

I always lifted very light since I didn't have a good coach for form and had to learn much of it from videos and the inside out, so to speak, but even light the Olympic lifts were also great in improving both my functional strength and my (formerly LOUSY) coordination.

Rippetoe is a great resource, and his philosophy of challenge in exercise is a great one.

5:39 PM, September 02, 2008  
Blogger look said...

情趣用品,
性感睡衣,
免費視訊聊天,
視訊交友網,
美姬圖影,
情境坊歡愉用品,
花美姬情趣用品,
成人圖片,
臺灣情色網,
嘟嘟情人色網,
色情網站,
情境坊歡愉用品,
徵信,
徵信公司,
徵信,
外遇,
徵信,
徵信,
抓姦,
徵信,
外遇,
徵信,
徵信社,
徵信社,
抓姦,
徵信社,
徵信社,
徵信社,
,
,
整型,
視訊聊天,
視訊交友,
AV女優,
色情,
A片,
A片,
情趣用品,
情色,
A片,
色情影片,
情趣用品,
A片,
AV女優,
視訊聊天室,
聊天,
情趣用品,
情惑用品性易購,
情侶歡愉用品,
A片,
情趣,
情惑用品性易購,
辣妹視訊,
自慰套,
情侶歡愉用品,
寄情築園小遊戲,
aio交友愛情館,
美女視訊,
色情A片,
情趣用品,
徵信社,
情趣用品,
A片,
美女視訊,
色情A片,
AV女優,
A片,
辣妹視訊,
自慰套,
情侶歡愉用品,

3:54 PM, March 15, 2009  
Blogger nini said...

85cc免費影城 愛情公寓正妹牆川藏第一美女 成人影片 情色交友網 美女視訊 美女視訊 視訊情人高雄網 JP成人影城 383成人影城 aa片免費a片下載 a片線上看aa片免費看 ※a片線上試看※sex520免費影片※ aa片免費看 BT成人論壇 金瓶影片交流區 自拍美女聊天室 aa片免費a片下載 SEX520免費影片 免費a片 日本美女寫真集 sex520aa免費影片 sex520aa免費影片 BT成人網 Hotsee免費視訊交友 百分百貼影片區 SEX520免費影片 免費視訊聊天室 情人視訊高雄網 星光情色討論版 正妹牆 383成人影城 線上85cc免費影城 85cc免費影城 85cc免費影城 85cc免費影城 ※免費視訊聊天室※ ※免費視訊聊天室※ 免費視訊聊天室 85cc免費影片 85cc免費影片 080苗栗人聊天室 080苗栗人聊天室 080中部人聊天室 080中部人聊天室 免費a片下載 免費a片 AA片免費看 aa片免費看 aa片免費看 aa片免費看 aa片免費看 日本av女優影片 av女優 av女優無碼影城 av女優 av女優 百分百成人圖片 百分百成人圖片 視訊情人高雄網 電話交友 影音電話交友 絕色影城 絕色影城 夜未眠成人影城 夜未眠成人影城 色咪咪影片網 色咪咪影片網 色咪咪影片網 色咪咪影片網 色咪咪影片網 免費色咪咪貼影片 免費色咪咪貼影片 色情遊戲 色情遊戲 色情遊戲 色情遊戲 影音視訊交友網 視訊交友網 080視訊聊天室 ※免費視訊聊天室※ ※免費視訊聊天室※ 視訊聊天室 成人影音視訊聊天室 ut影音視訊聊天室 ※免費視訊聊天室※ 視訊ukiss聊天室視訊ukiss聊天室 視訊交友90739 視訊交友90739 情人視訊網 168視訊美女 168視訊美女 168視訊美女 視訊美女館 視訊美女館 免費視訊美女網 小高聊天室 小高聊天室 aio交友聊天室 aio交友聊天室 交友聊天室 交友聊天室 線上a片 線上a片 線上a片 線上a片 線上a片 免費線上a片 免費線上a片 嘟嘟成人網站 成人漫畫 情色文學 嘟嘟成人網 成人貼圖區 情色文學成人小說 微風成人區 情色貼圖區 免費視訊聊天 免費成人圖片區 愛情公寓 愛情公寓聊天室 寄情築園小遊戲 免費aa片線上看 aa片免費看 情色SXE聊天室 SEX情色遊戲 色情A片 免費下載 av女優 俱樂部 情色論壇 辣妹視訊 情色貼圖網 免費色情 聊天室 情人視訊聊天室 免費a片成人影城 免費a片-aa片免費看 0204貼圖區 SEX情色 交友聊天-線上免費 女優天堂 成人交友網 成人情色貼圖區 18禁 -女優王國 080視訊美女聊天室 080視訊聊天室 視訊交友90739 免費a片 aio 視訊交友網 成人影城-免費a片※免費視訊聊天※85cc免費影片日本線上免費a片 免費色咪咪影片免費色咪咪影片aaa片免費看影片aaa片免費看成人影城免費色咪咪影片

3:44 PM, April 06, 2009  
Blogger 天天看正妹 said...

免費視訊聊天 ut聊天室辣妹視訊UT影音視訊聊天室 吉澤明步QQ美女視訊秀 85cc免費影片aa影片下載城sex免費成人影片aaa片免費看短片美女視訊 sex383線上娛樂場av969 免費短片日本免費視訊aa影片下載城視訊網愛聊天室影音視訊交友 咆哮小老鼠分享論壇sex520免費影片aa免費影片下載城aio辣妺視訊 aio辣妹交友愛情館 jp成人影片aio交友愛情館馬子免費影片免費線上a片18成人85cc影城0204movie免費色咪咪視訊網pc交友s383視訊玩美女人34c高雄視訊聊天jp成人免費視訊辣妹 kk777視訊俱樂部xxxpandalive173影音視訊聊天室 sex520-卡通影片成人免費視訊 完美女人13060 免費視訊聊天sexy girl video movie辣妹妹影音視訊聊天室UT視訊美女交友視訊情色網百事無碼a片dvd線上aa片免費看18禁成人網ut聊天室kk俱樂部視訊激情網愛聊天 情人小魔女自拍卡通aa片免費看夜未眠成人影城aio性愛dvd辣妹影片直播拓網視訊交友視訊聊天室ggoo168論壇視訊辣妹love104影音live秀 美女show-live視訊情色yam交友辣妹妹影音視訊聊天室s383情色大網咖視訊aaa俱樂部台灣情色網無碼avdvdsexy diamond sex888入口Show-live視訊聊天室

5:11 AM, April 15, 2009  
Blogger 天天看正妹 said...

免費 a 片aaaaa片俱樂部影片aaaaa片俱樂部dodo豆豆聊天室sex520網路自拍美女聊天室天堂免費線上avdvd援交av080影片aa影片下載城aaa片免費看短片成人圖片區18成人avooogo2av免費影片sexdiy影城免費線上成人影片bonbonsex0951影片下載日本av女優sex888免費看影片免費視訊78論壇辣妹有約辣妹no31314視訊dudu sex免費影片avdvd情色影片免費色咪咪影片網av080免費試看日本美女寫真集辣妹脫衣麻將視訊聊天室性福免費影片分享日本美女寫真集,kk視訊aio交友愛情館免費成人美女視訊bt論壇色情自拍免費a片卡通tw 18 net卡通18美少女圖色情漫畫777美女小護士免費 aa 片試看百分百成人情色圖片a片免費觀賞sexy girls get fuckedsexy girl video movie情色文學成人小說sex888免費看eyny 伊莉論壇sexdiy影城自拍情色0204movie免費影片aio免費aa片試看s383情色大網咖sexy girl video movie草莓牛奶AV論壇台灣論壇18禁遊戲區環球辣妹聊天室 90691拓網aio交友愛情館拓網學生族視訊777美女 sex888影片分享區hi5 tv免費影片aa的滿18歲卡通影片sex383線上娛樂場sexdiy影城免費a片線上觀看真人美女辣妹鋼管脫衣秀比基尼辣妹一夜情視訊aio交友愛情館

5:11 AM, April 15, 2009  
Blogger 天天看正妹 said...

視訊做愛聊天室avdvd-情色網ut13077視訊聊天A片-無碼援交東京熱一本道aaa免費看影片免費視訊聊天室微風成人ut聊天室av1688影音視訊天堂85cc免費影城亞洲禁果影城微風成人av論壇sex520免費影片JP成人網免費成人視訊aaa影片下載城免費a片 ut交友成人視訊85cc成人影城免費A片aa的滿18歲影片小魔女免費影片小魔女免費影城免費看 aa的滿18歲影片sex383線上娛樂場kk777視訊俱樂部aa的滿18歲影片85cc免費影片a片免費看A片-sex520plus論壇sex520免費影片85cc免費影片aaa片免費看短片aa影片下載城aaaaa片俱樂部影片aaaaa片俱樂部aa的滿18歲影片小魔女免費影片台灣論壇免費影片免費卡通影片線上觀看線上免費a片觀看85cc免費影片免費A片aa影片下載城ut聊天室辣妹視訊UT影音視訊聊天室 日本免費視訊aaaa 片俱樂部aaa片免費看短片aaaa片免費看影片aaa片免費看短片免費視訊78論壇情色偷拍免費A片免費aaaaa片俱樂部影片後宮0204movie免費影片av俱樂部aaaa彩虹頻道免費影片 杜蕾斯成人免費卡通影片線上觀看85cc免費影片線上觀賞免費線上歐美A片觀看免費a片卡通aaa的滿18歲卡通影片sex520免費影片免費 a 片免費視訊聊天jp成人sex520免費影片

5:12 AM, April 15, 2009  
Blogger 徵信 said...

外遇外遇外遇外遇外遇外遇外遇外遇外遇 外遇
外遇 外遇外遇 外遇 外遇
外遇 外遇 外遇
外遇


外遇 外遇
外遇
外遇 外遇外遇
外遇

外遇 外遇外遇 外遇 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 ,
外遇 外遇 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇外遇 外遇外遇 外遇 外遇

外遇 外遇

外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇 , 外遇劈腿劈腿劈腿劈腿劈腿劈腿劈腿劈腿喜帖囍帖卡片外遇外遇 外遇 外遇外遇 外遇
外遇 外遇 外遇 外遇剖析 外遇調查 外遇案例 外遇諮詢 偷情 第三者外遇話題 外遇發洩 感情挽回 徵信社 外遇心態 外遇 通姦 通姦罪 外遇徵信社徵信社外遇 外遇 抓姦徵信協會徵信公司 包二奶 徵信社 徵信 徵信社 徵信社 徵信社 徵信社 徵信 徵信 婚姻 婚前徵信 前科 個人資料 外遇 第三者 徵信社 偵探社 抓姦 偵探社 偵探社婚 偵探社 偵探社偵探家事服務家事服務家電維修家事服務家事服務家事服務家事服務家事服務持久持久持久持久持久持久持久離婚網頁設計徵信社徵信社徵信徵信社外遇離婚協議書劈腿持久持久持久持久持久劈腿剖析徵信徵信社外遇外遇外遇外遇徵信社徵信社徵信社徵信社徵信社徵信社徵信徵信社徵信徵信徵信徵信徵信徵信徵信徵信徵信徵信徵信徵信徵信徵信徵信徵信徵信徵信徵信徵信徵信徵信徵信徵信社徵信社徵信社徵信社徵信社徵信社徵信社徵信社徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信公會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信公會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信公會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 徵信協會 劈腿 劈腿 劈腿 劈腿 劈腿 劈腿 劈腿 劈腿 劈腿 劈腿 劈腿 劈腿 劈腿 劈腿

1:39 AM, April 22, 2009  
Blogger 9988 said...

smiling,face.Not,only,can,answer,good,intentions,by,form.Can,also,shorten,distance,between,human,relationses!Happiness-not-is-getting-much.And-is-accounting-less~wish-happy-delectation....

10:31 AM, May 05, 2009  
Blogger 1798 said...

視訊做愛視訊美女無碼A片情色影劇kyo成人動漫tt1069同志交友網ut同志交友網微風成人論壇6k聊天室日本 avdvd 介紹免費觀賞UT視訊美女交友..........................

6:18 AM, May 20, 2009  
Blogger 1122 said...

潮吹百大正妹正妹18禁成人網a免費視訊聊天網正妹牆正妹日報無名正妹牆aa片正妹照片正妹百人斬天天看正妹無名正妹正妹裸照成人圖片百分百成人圖片一葉情貼圖片區 av127成人圖片區圖片34c甜心寶貝貼片貼圖片區<

4:59 AM, June 08, 2009  

Post a Comment

<< Home