Dr. Melissa: He's Just Not That Into You Because You're A Dumbass & A Vegetarian.
posted by Helen at 9:20 AM
Friday, May 16, 2008
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18 Comments:
My husband and I enjoy different things-what is so wrong with that? He introduced me to Russian cuisine, while I introduced him to wine. He reads fantasy and science fiction, whereas I am more into non-fiction. When we travel on a long car trip, we usually get two books on CD to listen to (each of us picking one) and we discuss the highs and lows of each. To each his own. And if I didn't have my husband around, I never would have read the Dune books which I dearly love.
Donna,
My sentiments exactly. If we were all the same, what would we ever learn? I also have learned much from my husband about sci fi, politics, and law in ways that have really expanded my knowledge base. There is so much polarization in our society these days and it seems that everyone wants a conformist to their own views and interests.
Jimminy Christmas some people are clueless! Good marriages are built on kindness, shared values, commitment, and emotional maturity. Food types and favored reading material? What a piece of puffery.
It seems that many people, dare I say especially those of the liberal persuasion, (I will dare as I have a headache and am grumpy) are looking for a twin, not a mate. Twins mirror us, mates compliment us. Unhealthy adult twinning is a form of narcissism.
Twinning is fine for 5 year olds, healthy even, but a marriage age person that needs a psychological twin to feel complete is a red flag, perhaps a red billboard. What will happen when the person in need of the twin notices are area of difference between their narcissistic projection and themselves? Nothing pretty, they will say that they are betrayed and look for a better fit. Save yourself some trouble, avoid those in search of their twin!
Trey
Agreed. I don't think it does much good to base a relationship on those sorts of things anyway. People change over time. Neither my wife or I are the same people we were when we got married--and for the most part, that's a GOOD thing (I know I'VE grown up a lot).
As it is, my wife became a vegan after we got married. By these people's reckoning I should scuttled the marriage and go find a fellow omnivore. Fortunately I was raised better than that. I may not share all of my wife's views in that area, but I love her, and I respect her views.
Furthermore, my wife just can't stand sci-fi/fantasy. Big deal. This is why I have other friends. My wife will always be my best friend, but if I need my sci-fi fix there are others to fill that role. Just like she has her friends she can relate to on certain things to a level I can't.
I think these "twinning" types are just lazy (and rather selfish, perhaps) and want to find the one, single person who will meet all their needs. It's the ultimate in cocooning or one-stop-shopping. "I can get all my physical, social, and emotional needs met from just one person."
It's a nice idea, but it's just not realistic. In fact, the idea is rather dangerous, and probably contributes heavily to the current rate of divorce.
I believe strong and rewarding marriages come as much from overcoming differences together as from building on common ground. Just as the strongest trees are those who have to drive down the deepest roots to overcome their environment, marriages are stronger from facing differences and learning from one another.
I just want to know what Dr. Melissa has against crawfish. Crawfish are yummy.
Could this desire for a "twin" as tmink describes it be a manifestation of the desire for a "soul mate"? After all, wouldn't a soul mate fit a nice long list of parameters that makes them the opposite sex mirror image?
Personally, I wonder how those list keepers would like it if someone they were interested in rejected them because of their own list of mandated traits. Those who demand perfection (as they define it) in others shouldn't mind when others point out their own inperfections, should they? Funny, I bet they do mind.
Next month, my wife an I will celebrate our 25th anniversary. We're both pretty adventurious when it comes to food. We have many things in common and yet many different interests. For example, I fell in love with flying long before I met her. She doesn't care for it very much. She'll ride along with me once in a while but for the most part, it just isn't her thing. That's ok, there are things she enjoys doing that bore me to tears.
If I'd bought into the "soul mate" fantasy, we probably would've never dated let alone married. And yet, here we are all these years later, for the most part happy and healthy. Our common interests bind us together while our different interests give us something to talk about. Marrying a "twin" of myself sounds rather boring.
Larry, you make a good point about people wanting a soul mate. I was so grumpy I was a bit negative. What is interesting is that they are not looking for a person who differs from them, who has strengths they do not, but a person who mirrors them. And that is an immature way to pursue a relationship.
A twin of me sounds boring too! There is no spice or surprise in that. You write about a mature relationship of give and take, growth and discovery, that strikes me as a mature and realistic partnership. Dude, 25 years, that is outstanding. Congratulations and God's continued blessings to both of you.
Trey
Trey: Damn good point up top.
I've got to say I spent far too long making that exact mistake. Perhaps it was an outgrowth of early decades of severe introversion.
Unfortunately I don't remember what turned on that lightbulb in my head. But I remember the effect of realizing that I'd been rejecting these wonderful girls based on this bizarre set of criteria that suddenly I saw for what it was.
Quite a shock THAT was I don't mind sayin' atall nosiree.
I did have a couple years of backlash when I dated the most radically incompatible girls I could find *coughhippiescough* (thinking that was somehow the solution.)
Fortunately I see the impulse when it shows up (well, how would I know for sure?), which it does with decreasing frequency.
I have nearly reasonable (which is not to say "pessimistic") expectations now :-)
dadvocate,
I grew up in Michigan. When my parents moved to New Orleans and I went to the Jazz Festival the first time, one of my first thoughts was, "What is that disgusting smell?" And then, we traipsed over to the food area and next to the BBQ were these huge barrels full of crawfish. I had to run around the building and hold back the heaving.
And yet, I might even consider a crawfish-loving man, all things considered....except for the minor detail that I'm married. And thankfully, the hubby doesn't have a love of crawfish. Phew. And, he even come to like Sci Fi and politics (a little) now!
All of this talk about twinning, etc, has gotten me thinking (a dangerous thing at times). My brother in law married, in essence, the exact same woman. His first wife was financially irresponsible in that she ran up huge electricity and phone bills while they were married that he was stuck paying. His second wife did not run up utility bills but ran up substantially large credit card debt, some of which did not come to light until after their divorce was final.
Both of his marriages lasted less than five years and he seems well on his way to a third marriage of the same sorts. When my husband (his brother) asked him what he sees in his current girlfriend, he said "It is so nice to be needed so much"...
My husband on the other hand just shakes his head at his brother and now refuses to discuss the situation with him. We've been married seventeen years and its been wonderful because we respect each others talents and accept each other's faults.
I know this is a completely different subject, but Helen, what do you think of people who basically re-marry the same type of person even if it is not the same person?
Do you think the idea of "twinning" comes from insecurity? It seems like so many people need to be shown to be "right" by proving that anyone different is "wrong." So, if being a sci-fi loving vegetarian is right, I have to marry one of same, yes? 'Cause if I married an omnivorous non-reader, there must be something wrong with one of us, and God forbid it turn out to be me.
That said, I would have a hard time being married to a vegetarian - being the cook of the family - just as a practical matter. We are all omnivores here, with the usual assortment of likes and dislikes.
Soulmates are made, not found.
A soulmate doesn't enjoy everything you enjoy and insist on doing it with you. Your soulmate does everything he or she can to make sure that you have the opportunity to do what you enjoy, and then listens earnestly and honestly as you describe how much you enjoyed it.
I do appreciate the idea of "twinning." I wonder how much of the divorce rate in the U.S. can be attributed to those who thought they were marrying a soulmate and wound up marrying a twin.
After all, to this day, I struggle to fathom what my wife sees in me because, if I had to choose, there's no way I'd choose me.
Do you think the idea of "twinning" comes from insecurity? It seems like so many people need to be shown to be "right" by proving that anyone different is "wrong."
Or perhaps it's an over inflated ego (too much self-esteem). If someone thinks they're perfect then why should they settle for anyone who isn't?
All I can say is, I hope they enjoy the company of cats. They aren't likely to find anyone that will live up to their unrealistic expectations.
Donna,
"I know this is a completely different subject, but Helen, what do you think of people who basically re-marry the same type of person even if it is not the same person?"
I would say that in the example you gave of your brother-in-law-- marrying exactly the same woman may show he has learned little about the dynamics that keep driving him to pick women who fulfill the need to be needed.
Internal drives that people have change little if they do not work on them, explore them and use them in constructive ways. The need to be needed in a pathological way came from somewhere--whether it was childhood or later in the teen years. This need to be needed is so strong that it may have caused your brother-in-law to overlook the reality of what these women were about. He may be trying to recapitulate something from childhood or his past that did not work out. In other words, being needed is a stronger drive than taking a hard look at the character of the women he is marrying. And in some sense, having the women take advantage of him reinforces his need to be needed and therefore, he is able to overlook the problems until they become overwhelming.
Overall, I think that people marry the same kind of person over again even if they are not good for them because it seems familiar from the past and also fulfills some type of desire or perhaps a wish--this time she/he will love me--even if nothing could be further from the truth.
Larry J wrote:
All I can say is, I hope they enjoy the company of cats. They aren't likely to find anyone that will live up to their unrealistic expectations.
I think you mean company of dogs. As an owner of cats, I'm pretty sure their expectations are unrealistic, too.
A Labrador retriever, on the other hand...
Mike wrote: "But I remember the effect of realizing that I'd been rejecting these wonderful girls based on this bizarre set of criteria that suddenly I saw for what it was."
Man, when I realize something stupid I am doing, it makes my day! I used to be able to diagnose high functioning borderline personality disordered patients by the attraction I would feel for them. I would think something like "With the right caring man, someone like me, this person could really flourish."
I would recognize my narcissism and could make the diagnosis. It never failed, until it did. It is gone now! I grew out of it! As I reduced my own narcissism issues, the attraction disappeared.
derek wrote: "Soulmates are made, not found."
Wow, that is certainly and important and salient point! Outstanding post.
Trey
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