More Female Abusers in the News
Thanks to desert light journal for pointing out these two interesting articles--one from Time.com on female pedophiles and the other at CNN.com about men who have been abused by women. When I read the latter article which states "it was hard to believe the three men's story: that they were victims of physical abuse at the hands of their female partners," all I could think was, is this really surprising news anymore? I guess it is to CNN.
posted by Helen at 4:14 PM
25 Comments:
Helen,
What is it about the story that makes you think CNN is surprised?
You just posted an item about a coach who died of arrythmia. Is it valid to say you are surprised young and seemingly healthy people die of arrythmia?
Is it possible for either you or CNN to post items for reasons other than surprise?
theres some figures that say 1 in 4 women are victims of domestic violence, but 1 in 6 men are as well.. but you never hear these stories, but if you look you will see more and more women acting like the so called beasts that men were. i am not surprised that men are coming forward they have had enough. they are sick and tired of all this hypocrisy, and just imagine how many doesnt get spoken about as men are supposed to be real men and take it, that men who do get abused are somehow losers, or somehow deserve it.
anonymous,
When a story starts with, "It is hard to believe...it indicates suprise--domestic abuse against men is old (but ignored) news. I do appreciate CNN having an article about an ignored topic, however.
And actually, no I am not surprised that seemingly healthy people die of arrythmia, it is more common than people think with 930 Americans dying each day according to the American Heart Association--"About 335,000 people a year die of coronary heart disease without being hospitalized or admitted to an emergency room. That's about half of all deaths from CHD — more than 930 Americans each day. Most of these are sudden deaths caused by cardiac arrest."
Mercurior,
Who says men are supposed to be real men and take it? I'd suggest any spouse in such a situation leave and get a divorce.
by the attitudes of the people
********When I read the latter article which states "it was hard to believe the three men's story: that they were victims of physical abuse at the hands of their female partners********
police here have laughed at men who claim to be abused, and the generally arrest the man, for the womans safety.
For probably 30 years, the feminist mantra has been: "Men are scum, women are saints. Men only behave well when they do what women want them to and women only behave badly when men make them." I think that most men would accept that men very often are scum and behave badly. (Some of the most paranoid people I know are fathers of really pretty and independent teenage daughters.) But what has become apparent is that women's application for sainthood was very premature. I think that a lot of women, especially those currently in their teens and 20s, are going to find the next decade very unpleasant.
partly its men have been told we are, so we are.. might as well be hung as a sheep than as a lamb
On The One Hand...
If they were surprised then none of them have ever worked on a locked psychiatric unit or women's prison. Robert Avrech over at Seraphic Secret can get you up to speed with his well-written series (he is a professional screenwriter, as in "Body Double") @ http://www.seraphicpress.com/archives/2006/01/how_not_to_talk.php
On The Other Hand
It pays to withhold agreement when someone tells you they have been abused, male or female. And also to withhold agreement if anyone, male or female, tells you they are falsely accused. This is an area where the ground is always shifting, and sometimes impossible to sort out.
Not that you should be unsympathetic to such claims and counterclaims, because that would in itself be hurtful. But it is best to remain noncommittal: "that must have been frightening," etc.
Twenty-some years ago, I worked with a woman who was doing her Master's thesis on men whose mothers had abused them. I have been vaguely aware for much longer than that that more men are abused by mothers, wives, or other women, than we ever hear about.
In earlier times, a man who "came out" as a victim of a female abuser were considered weak, wimpy, whiney--definitely not a "real man." Unfair. 'Course, a woman who stays with a man who abuses her is also looked at askance: "Why didn't you just leave? Why did you go back to him/let him come back?" The difference is that the PC'ers of today will, indeed, elevate her to sainthood among victims. In the same climate, men who are abused by women are more likely treated by many (PC) women as thoroughly deserving--just because they are men. Also unfair.
AVI's recommendation of noncommittal sympathy certainly makes sense, to me, especially for those who are investigating a claim. But I have to wonder how many men would falsely accuse a woman of outright abuse. Women do that a lot, I think, but don't men tend to just leave, when they get fed up?
vicki,
Who is treating women like saints and men as deserving? How do these people know a particular person is being abused? How does the PC crowd know unless the person tells them? And, why would they tell them? Sounds like they are looking for some reaction. I suspect some people find satisfaction in being public victims.
Vicki, you are right, but add in one point. Men will use abuse by women as a justification of their own abusiveness. In that situation they will stick around. It's also one of the things that makes working with people difficult -- sometimes both people are guilty, and both have legitimate complaints.
As someone who's worked in and among social service and private philanthropic agencies in the DC region, I can attest to the high incidence of mutual assault among domestic partners. Physical confrontations are very common among some populations, especially where drugs, poverty, and general tumult combine to erode standards of conduct.
That said, I'm dubious of the proposition that we're going to revisit popular assumptions regarding domestic abuse any time soon.
Do you really think that CNN or the New York Times is going to acknowledge that Feminists' advocacy has resulted in an increase in infanticide and child abuse? There's too much at stake politically, and feminists have put themselves out on a limb endorsing these claims. I just don't see any way for them to step down from their positions without acknowledging that they've been lying to the public.
The problem with dancing with the devil is that you lose your soul when the dance ends.
well, i know of a few stories, a girl of my acquaintence, got given to her mother her custody, now this woman was abusive towards her daughter in a REALLY nasty way, the police knew, the courts knew, but the kid was placed with her.
there is a perception that women are the best people to raise kids, but some of them shouldnt have kids in the first place, and you can see this in the stories of mothers killing their children, the warning signs are there, but since the social services are told women can do no harm by feminist organisations, it places these kids in danger..
V:
Basically by having commandeered child abuse as a womens' issue and then refusing to acknowledge or deal with maternal abuse. They've taken public money in the name of child abuse prevention and protective services but have then used these funds for advocacy efforts - promoting a very distorted picture of the typical abuse scenario. By taking funds away from legitimate programs, they reduce the capacity of these programs to serve children in need. These unserved children will most likely continue to be abused and many will eventually be killed. So the reason that Feminist policies have contributed to child abuse and infanticide is because these policies prevent children from receiving help and reduce the total amount of assistance that the system can provide.
also..
Womens' shelters typically do not allow adolescent males, fearing they'll intimidate the other women. These males are often the last line of defense between younger siblings and a violent mother.
They tend to horde their clients. Once a woman enters the system through a womens' shelter she's likely to be channelled to like minded organizations for additional services. This is how an abuser can 'slip through the cracks'. No one's looking at her behavior critically.
Their politics and advocacy efforts turn-off clients in need of help. For instance, I've had more than one client tell me that she didn't want to go to a certain shelter because she wasn't a lesbian. This wasn't a 'lesbian shelter' but the staff was so hardcore in their advocacy that they intimidated the residents.
Now I'm not stating all of this to condemn feminism. I agree with most of the traditional goals of feminism. But anyone who exploits people in such desperate circumstances needs to be called on it.
I know for a FACT women are abusive, too. My mother was horrendously abusive to both my father and me. And my father NEVER laid a hand on my mother. My father would go to work with scratches all over his face. My mother would just blow up for no reason at all, and start beating me and/or my father. She would also get extremely drunk, and once, even started a fire whilst drunk, that I, as an 8 year old, had to put out. She even attempted to kill us both. She was also horribly verbally abusive to us.
There is a movie about an abused man. It's called 'Men Don't Tell' In this movie, the man tried to find a shelter, and there were none.
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0107553/
It's so sad that there is only one movie about an abusive woman, but thousands about abusive men.
Anonymous 2:26,
You didn't demonstrate that child abuse has increased as a result of feminism. What time are you using as a baseline?
It's so sad that there is only one movie about an abusive woman, but thousands about abusive men.
+ 3 television channels, 7 or 8 periodicals, and women's study programs across the country.
I've often wondered why it is that women enjoy narratives in which innocent women are victimized. For instance, cable channels such as E and Lifetime are filled with low budget formulaic paranoia films - My Husband Stole My Baby, My Prettier Younger Sister Seduced My Husband and They Stole My Baby , My Babysitter Stole My .., et.al.
What do women get out of these stories? Has anyone studied this? Is it possible that women are more prone to perceiving themselves as victims and so tend to describe their relationships in those terms? <- I'm not trying to be a jerk by writing that, it's a sincere question.
re: proof
JW is right, you'd need to look at comparative results.
Unfortunately you can't establish 'proof' of specific policy affects using the statistical data that we collect. You'd likely need to do a controlled study. The problem here is that it's unethical to expose children to harm for the purposes of experimentation.
But if you're willing to consider proxies, take a look at the incidence rate increases for female dominated abuse types in the data below, and in comparison to more recent reporting. The policies that I'm criticizing came into bloom in the early to mid nineties, during the Clinton administration. The 96' NIS data should reflect some of the affects.
( NIS-3 , 1996 )
http://nccanch.acf.hhs.gov/pubs/statsinfo/nis3.cfm
( Child Mistreatment 2004 , 2006 )
typology
http://www.acf.hhs.gov/programs/cb/pubs/cm04/chapterthree.htm#types
composition
http://www.acf.hhs.gov/programs/cb/pubs/cm04/figure3_3.htm
patterns of recurrence
http://www.acf.hhs.gov/programs/cb/pubs/cm04/chapterthree.htm#recurrence
gender
http://www.acf.hhs.gov/programs/cb/pubs/cm04/figure3_6.htm
_______________
There plenty more here - http://nccanch.acf.hhs.gov/general/stats/index.cfm
* notice any specific mention of womens' prominence as abusers ? - how about men?
JW said:
"Any talk of increasing child abuse is based on increase over where we would be if we did not have discrimination in favor of violent women."
I'd suggest you don't know where we would be without the discrimination you allege. It's a guess. So the increase is todays abuse minus the guess.
Maurice, I watched a couple of those WIP (women in peril) movies and made a vow never to watch Lifetime again. Why other women watch those movies is something I will never fathom. I like and admire the male sex too much to watch them get bashed by this harpy network.
"What do women get out of these stories? Has anyone studied this? Is it possible that women are more prone to perceiving themselves as victims and so tend to describe their relationships in those terms?"
Perhaps it is congenial to a sick sense of femininity, that to be truly feminine is to be frail and dainty. Whatever the cause turns out to be be, you are right to kook for the benefits to the behavior.
This may be the explanation for the way men put up with abuse. The reverse kind of sick sense of masculinity is the blame. Note how often it is only women who are the ones to protect men from other women, or who, like Woman abused by mother, are the only ones willing to tell the truth about abusive women.
One aspect of discrimination in the law is selective designation od behaviors as abusive - behaviors that one group is likelier to do as opposed to another group - for instance if verbal abuse is not legally sanctioned while physical abuse is.
I've read a lot of comments filled with guesswork and maybe-so's, but not a one that has concrete evidence that feminism has increased the rate of child abuse.
Two things: Best friend has worked for 25 years as a nurse in the psych and drug abuse wards. The overwhelming number of abusers are male. Perhaps the data isn't slanted. Perhaps it's factual. And some of the abuse stories she can tell you from victims who wind up in the psych ward due to suicide attempts, drug use, etc., would curl your hair.
Thing the second: I looked up the data myself a year ago to help a friend researching a paper for class. The statistics bear out that the overwhelming number of abusers are male.
If you want me to believe that more women are abusing men, give me data. Supposition is not fact.
EvilPundit,
The summary you posted doesn't mention child abuse.
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