Monday, August 03, 2009

Angry voter syndrome


In many ways, Obama embodies the American Dream. He speaks of how his mother and grandmother sacrificed to provide him with opportunities they never had.

With unemployment far higher than most economists expected when he took office, Obama will need to convince Americans that the dream is still attainable.

Two groups hit hard by unemployment — unionized labor and college students — were also among Obama's strongest supporters in his presidential campaign.

Jason Harper, 22, can't find a job in his chosen field, advertising, despite a Princeton degree and more experience than most people his age. "I thought that it would be a bit easier than it is to find a job," he said. He's now looking for advertising jobs in Germany.

While younger people still support Obama, the longer they go without jobs commensurate with their expensive educations, the less happy they will be.

A big test for Obama comes next year, when most members of Congress face mid-term elections. High unemployment breeds angry voters, and a normal response is to toss out the incumbent.

One can only hope...I remember talking to a guy who was working as a freelancer with a cable company who said he was voting for Obama because he would "make a lot of money like he did under Clinton." I wonder what he thinks now or if he even has a job.

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Blogger Toysoldier said...

Well, it has only been six months since Obama has been in office. I and many of my friends graduated at the end of Bush's first four years. All of us have had trouble finding steady work. Only two people I know managed to find jobs in their field. The rest are either working at a job they do not like or they are struggling to find freelance work.

All this happened during Bush's administration, and it particularly effected college graduates who have found that their diplomas are essentially worthless.

I think in the coming years the situation will improve. However, the situation as it is remains largely the fault of Bush and his administration and the things he and Congress allowed to occur (or caused).

1:21 PM, August 03, 2009  
Blogger Helen said...


Just remember that the Congress has had a Democrat majority since 2006. My guess is that as it gets more expensive and regulated in terms of hiring--it will only get worse.But good luck.

1:57 PM, August 03, 2009  
Blogger orthodoc said...

Jacob, I have no idea where you and your friends live, but you may want to check out today's NYT op-ed.

"The red-blue contrast is often overdrawn. But it’s a sensible way to understand Obama’s summer struggles. On health care, energy, taxes and spending, he’s pushing a blue-state agenda during a recession that’s exposed some of the blue-state model’s weaknesses, and some of the red-state model’s strengths. . . .

Texas looks like a model citizen. The Lone Star kept growing well after the country had dipped into recession. Its unemployment rate and foreclosure rate are both well below the national average. It’s one of only six states that didn’t run budget deficits in 2009.

Meanwhile, California, long a paradise for regulators and public-sector unions, has become a fiscal disaster area. And it isn’t the only dark blue basket case. Eight states had unemployment over 11 percent in June; seven went for Barack Obama last November. Fourteen states are facing 2010 budget gaps that exceed 20 percent of their G.D.P.; only two went for John McCain. (Strikingly, they’re McCain’s own Arizona and Sarah Palin’s Alaska.) Of the nine states that have raised taxes this year, closing deficits at the expense of growth, almost all are liberal bastions.

The urban scholar Joel Kotkin has called this recession a blue-state “meltdown.”

3:23 PM, August 03, 2009  
Blogger I R A Darth Aggie said...

All this happened during Bush's administration, and it particularly effected college graduates who have found that their diplomas are essentially worthless.

What did they major in? some diplomas are inherently worthless. At least by themselves, as they're just the base minimum you need to get into grad or law school.

5:01 PM, August 03, 2009  
Blogger Dr.Alistair said...

there are jobs out there. dig ditches, cut grass.....

..there is a lot of mythology about what a degree can do for you...mostly foisted on the young.

i know some people who make ferrari money digging ditches and cutting grass by the way.

5:13 PM, August 03, 2009  
Anonymous Anonymous said...


Colleges / universities are the 7th largest industry in the U.S. I'd say 6th largest now.

Depending on your degree, it is a worthy endeavor. But as was said, some are horse manure. Don't tell my daughter this, but I just spent a few days out her way working, and found time to visit her at school. (She's been going around the clock, around the calendar for the 7th year straight now) Although running down her Ph.D. what she is currently doing is similar to what she and I used to do running around in the woods and hill sides gathering leaves and small plants for her 3rd grade science projects.

7:51 PM, August 03, 2009  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Is any college / university going to offer worthless programs yielding worthless degrees? Of course not!

Would they tell you, truly, if it were?

Unfortunately, my daughter is at one of the UC locations - speaking of the mess CA is in.

Too bad all endeavors can't be as well done as GE. You manufacture the equipment that generates electricity. And you manufacture the appliances and other type equipment that consumes it.

8:03 PM, August 03, 2009  
Blogger Charlie said...

Jacob --

You are certainly right that some of the things that the Bush administration & Congress did fiscally caused problems. Trouble is, the Obama administration and congress are doubling down on the bad things from the Bush era. (The Repubs really blew it, with their spending, earmarks, crony deals, etc. They were in a position to show sound financial thinking, and didn't.)

8:09 PM, August 03, 2009  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Your vast experience of having worked during one presidential administration notwithstanding, neither Bush nor Obama made the degrees of your generation worthless. That trend started before them.
For what it is worth, many people far older (I started working in Ford Administration) are also "not working in their chosen field" or are working a job they do not like. It is called maturity. Providing for your family isn't always from big pay for little work. If it were fun, they wouldn't have to pay us to do it.

9:34 PM, August 03, 2009  
Blogger DADvocate said...

dr.alistair - I saw a bit on TV about a guy who collects golf balls from the bottoms of ponds on courses, cleans them and resells them. He drives a Ferrari.

11:24 PM, August 03, 2009  
Blogger Unknown said...

Please. Back in the 70's under Jimmah Carter, my hubby couldn't find a job in his field either. Wah wah wah. He took a job as a store auditor (counting inventory!) with a degree in mathematics and economics. He worked his way up through the ranks and now has a very high level position.

My point is, just do something - start somewhere. Back then there were the privileged ones who were too good to do most jobs, and if anything, it's gotten worse. A college education is NOT job training (with some exceptions like nursing or teaching) for Pete's sake.

I am tired of the whining. And I think we have a current president who, because "his mother and grandmother sacrificed to provide him with opportunities they never had", has apparently never had to sacrifice, suffer, or be allowed to fail himself. If he has, I wish someone would share those stories, since failure, suffering, and sacrifice are the sources of wisdom and compassion.

7:18 AM, August 04, 2009  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

K sez "Back in the 70's under Jimmah Carter, my hubby couldn't find a job in his field either. Wah wah wah. He took a job ..."


Did you have the same experience and success?

If so, why are you citing A DIFFERENT person's story and not your own?

If you didn't, maybe you are a hypocrite - citing someone else's story and you yourself weren't even successful.

7:34 AM, August 04, 2009  
Blogger Dr. K. said...

"All this happened during Bush's administration, and it particularly effected college graduates who have found that their diplomas are essentially worthless."

I think that not knowing the difference between "effected" and "affected" helped to make your diploma worthless.

Oh, and BTW, having a diploma does not mean you are worthy of being hired. In my second interview with my first employer at the time, I was sitting in the company President's office. The man looked at me and said: "You know you will have to produce, or you're out of here. What do you think of that?"

I answered: "Isn't that how it's supposed to work?"

I got the job.

7:41 AM, August 04, 2009  
Blogger amr said...

One day a worker came to a friend who was a manager and said this work is not fun. He replied that, " If work was fun then work would be called fun not work, so get back to work".

7:43 AM, August 04, 2009  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"I answered: "Isn't that how it's supposed to work?" "


What else were you supposed to say?

7:49 AM, August 04, 2009  
Blogger KCFleming said...

Voters are angry they elected the most far-left liberal in the Senate and he instituted a far-left agenda?

Do they strike a match and think water comes out?
Do they punch drunken bikers and see what happens?

Obama is governing exactly the way most of us predicted. We're screwed and it's the fault of Obama supporters.

You're unemployed? Get used to it.
This is your responsibility; elections have consequences.

7:56 AM, August 04, 2009  
Blogger Dr. K. said...

JG - True Story.

In reality there was no other answer. No, "What if I do my best and fail?" equivocations.

Too many people of the "Jacob" mindset - that things are owed to them.

8:04 AM, August 04, 2009  
Blogger Mick Kraut said...

"All this happened during Bush's administration, and it particularly effected college graduates who have found that their diplomas are essentially worthless."

What exactly did the Bush administration do to make their degrees worthless?
Do you have anything to support that?
What degrees do you and your friends struggling for work possess?
Like Cousin Eddie from "Vacation" are they "holding out for a management position"?
Where are you geographically?

As the Recruiting Manager for a $500M division of a much larger company I can tell you that many many degrees arent worth the paper they are printed on. Sure the graduates are usually bright and eager but their degrees are fluff and lack any real substance. A BS in Psychology or Sociology does not prepare you for anything other than graduate school (and more debt).

The recent college graduates we hire are in engineering disciplines (Electrical, Computer etc.) or with Finance/Accounting degrees. Even then we have a difficult time in finding the largely owing to the fact that fewer and fewer students are graduating in these disciplines in favor of Liberal Arts degrees which simply are not vehicles to immediately meaningful employment.

Dont even get me started on the number of college graduates who simply cannot write a resume or avail themselves of the spellcheck feature.

When I graduated in 1994 with a degree in Human Resources and Employment Law it took me 9 months to get my first job as a benefits administrator for a construction company. Frankly anyone with a modicum of organizational skills was qualified for the position but I was grateful to land it. I can assure you that my employer didnt care about my ability to quote employment case law or my depth with the Wagner Act or Taft-Hartley. While interesting, none of that was the least bit useful to me until 10 years into my career.

Simply put, we have fetish-ized college education in this country either through slick marketing by institutes of higher learning or simple elitism. Education is an investment that pays LONG TERM benefits, not immediate ones. There is no educational replacement for experience.

8:13 AM, August 04, 2009  
Blogger Dusty said...

"I and many of my friends graduated at the end of Bush's first four years. All of us have had trouble finding steady work."

[Jacob @ 1:21 PM, August 03, 2009]

Per General Employment Status breakdown for 2004: Unemployment 5.3%


Per General Employment Status breakdown -- 25+ yo by educational attainment and by region -- for 2004: For the 13 Region/subregions unemployment ranged from 1.7% to 3.2%.


I don't doubt you and the friends you knew had a hard time finding jobs.

I do object to you offering your experience as the poster child for graduates across the board when it's clearly indicative not to be the case in 2004.

8:18 AM, August 04, 2009  
Blogger J said...

"All of us have had trouble finding steady work"

Jake, what did you major in? What part of the country are you in?

"it particularly effected college graduates"

You mean affected, not effective. Don't make mistakes like that on your resume or cover letters.

8:19 AM, August 04, 2009  
Blogger Dusty said...

Whoops, the last figure was for 25+ with bachelors degrees or higher.

8:21 AM, August 04, 2009  
Blogger Beth Donovan said...

College does not give anyone the skills needed for employment in most cases. What college does, hopefully, is give people an understanding of the world, how things come about and perhaps even where an individual might fit in. Even more importantly, college should teach one to communicate properly.

When I was working in the IT field, (before I was fortunate enough to be laid off and start working for myself) I found that many, many graduates of "great" schools (M.I.T. comes to mind), were brilliant people. However, their communication skills were so awful and their own self-images were so high that they angered customers - telling them that they were stupid if they didn't get how the software worked, etc.

The company would then send someone like me to the customer to make them happy. I could communicate with and teach customers what the brainiacs could not - because of their arrogance and their poor communication skills.

And I'm an old fart. I graduated from college before there were PCs. But, I could learn an adapt and communicate without offending someone, even with a liberal arts degree.

I believe it is all in the attitude.

8:35 AM, August 04, 2009  
Blogger Unknown said...

Obama will take heat due to young people and union-types with employment woes.

But, this is not an appropriate issue to pin on either party. OK, well, maybe a little more blame on the Dem side than the Repub side due to Dems macro-economic policies which inhibit competitiveness. But there's blame for everyone.

Problems for young employees:
- excessive taxes that hinder business
- too many colleges; making more grads than needed
- watered down degrees. Todays Bachelors Degree is the new High School Diploma
- not enough people interested in hard sciences like engineering
- too many law schools, which contributes to excessive litigation, which adds non-value cost to good & services
- skilled trades dominated by inefficient unions; so work goes overseas, or is excessively priced
- not enough manufacturing jobs due to taxes and inefficient unions; the US doesn't "make" anything anymore
- too many service jobs; most of which just are horrible careers
- the ever-expanding US govt which has grossly interfered with free markets

Ya. Obama and the Dems will take it on the chin at mid-terms. But the blame should go farther. VOTE OUT ALL INCUMBENTS.

8:39 AM, August 04, 2009  
Blogger Cato Renasci said...

An overlooked aspect of the potential disillusionment of the young college graduates who supported Obama, especially those who have degrees in the social sciences and humanities and increasingly including those with graduate degrees, is that many (most?) of them have significant student loans to pay off - anywhere from $15,000 to more than $150,000 - and they are not finding jobs that enable them to pay the interest, let alone retire the principal balances. These debts essentially make these young graduates debt slaves, because they cannot be discharged by a bankruptcy (as student loans were before the mid-1990s). When students default, the fees, extra interest and penalties rapidly mount, often amounting to twice to three times the original amount borrowed.

In many cases, one of the draws of public employment of various sorts for these college graduates with loan debt is the suspension of interest and/or forgiveness of substantial portions of the debt.

How this cohort of young people will fall out politically, I think, will depend greatly on how the coming student debt crisis -- now that many young grads can't find work or have lost jobs -- if the administration does not find a way to get rid of the debts, I think these young people will become increasingly bitter and radicalized. How, is unclear.

Rationally, if they understood the way in which the left-dominated academia and Congress over the past 30 years has encouraged the growth of loan-based aid rather than scholarship, and the role of vast amounts of cheap government or government guaranteed money (at least it so seems) in the huge increase of the cost of college relative to the rest of the economy, they might well turn to a populist right, demanding a cancellation of the debts, but in conjunction with a return to the older model of scholarship funding at private institutions and greater subsidies at public ones.

Alternatively, they may well move ever further to the left, given their academic training has not exposed them to classical liberal or conservative economic or political theory.

This will be very interesting.... in the Chinese sense.

8:42 AM, August 04, 2009  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

SWWBO writes "I could communicate with and teach customers what the brainiacs could not ..."


At least that's the stereotype.

In reality, some smart people can communicate and some stupid people can't.

8:45 AM, August 04, 2009  
Blogger SGT Ted said...

Jacob, you can join the military with that degree and make real good money in no time. The Army is short on officers right now; great career opportunities there.But if that is beneath you then you don't deserve a job.

9:02 AM, August 04, 2009  
Blogger Beth Donovan said...

Heh. JG - I'm not sure if you are suggesting I'm not smart or what by you comment.

Stereotypes of this nature are often based on fact.

And the fact is that too many smart young people cannot write a complete sentence and cannot speak to a client without being annoyingly condescending.

Again, it has little to do with what degree one might have and a lot to do with attitude.

You will NOT be successful if you you are a smart, arrogant twit who is rude to clients.

Colleges are allowing people to graduate in the hard sciences without requiring them to learn to write a proper sentence.

Grammar is important.

Being polite is even more important.

9:04 AM, August 04, 2009  
Blogger Holmes said...

Of course, the government is hiring and there's always the ever-expanding community organizer field.

9:09 AM, August 04, 2009  
Blogger Unknown said...

Tether, I took a job in my field (chemistry) during that time. I made a fine income for 2 years until the position was done away with - yes, downsizing occurred way back then, too.

When we discovered that we could live on one income with me babysitting my neighbor's kids, we decided to start a family, and I was a homemaker and stay-at-home mom for 9 years. When my youngest was old enough for kindergarten, I was offered the opportunity to learn how to be a computer programmer and work from home for a small business, because I had a reputation for being smart and reliable, with a good work ethic. It was a perfect combination - I could do some work from home and do the consulting part while my kids were in school. I had to study and do many long hours of on-the-job training to learn how to do the work. I did this job for 15 years until our kids were out of school. I now work for a non-profit.

I did not find "success" in my field or in monetary compensation but in being open to learning new things and in welcoming change. My husband accepted the responsibilty and did the hard work of financially supporting the family. That was our choice. And my greatest joy is my family, not my job.

Your tone in your comment sounded so negative - I hope you didn't intend to come across that way, and I hope that I've answered your questions. I also hope that if you are personally having a hard time, you will search for encouragement and new ways of thinking and learning.

9:20 AM, August 04, 2009  
Blogger Simon Kenton said...

You can pass some blame to parents who allowed kids to spend money for this drivel. I told mine, "I don't pay for Cs."

"I don't pay for useless degrees. To start with, anything with 'studies' is a useless degree. For a further determination of worthlessness, see me before declaring a major."

"You had better examine the salaries in your chosen field before incurring debt. Physician, $100,000, ok. Elementary school librarian, $20,000, not OK. If you don't know what you intend to do, $0."

My cold advice to the kids is predicated on having 2 useless degrees. But I retired in my 50s. What is really useful, no matter your degree, is mastering financial planning, and putting it into effect. (Perhaps, in commemoration, I should say 'into affect?')

I instance 2 former girlfriends I counseled financially. One was an absolute mistress of budgeting. Lived to the penny on what she made. She reached 40 exactly zeroed out. No debt, no assets, net worth $0. The other has a net worth over $1MM despite monthly budget atrocities, gross overspending on private school for her daughter, and long periods of unemployment (oil and gas). When employed she really does save, and does invest, and fusses over her rental but keeps it full.

9:22 AM, August 04, 2009  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"I did not find "success" in my field or in monetary compensation ..."


Then what's with the "wah wah wah" and the "advice" for people who do have to find success and not be a friggin' parasite.


"I also hope that if you are personally having a hard time"


I'm doing fine and thinking about retiring. I did struggle when I was young, and mouthy parasites who are full of advice still bother me. They bothered me then and they bother me today.

Go watch Oprah or the View. You apparently have no idea what you are talking about.

9:36 AM, August 04, 2009  
Blogger TMink said...

Making good grades on tests and papers is a very different skill from communicating with people and being likeable.

Many smart people posses an abundance of skills, but people skills and social/emotional intelligence are not necessarily part of the set.

People with very high emotional/social skills make us think they are smarter than they are because of how well they read and respond to us.


9:37 AM, August 04, 2009  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The worst I saw with a female parasite was when my older brother came back from Viet Nam. The old term was shell-shocked, I guess the modern term is PTSS.

A parasitic house-pig made comments that he should just "be a man" and "shake it off".

THAT'S the level of empathy that house-pigs have. They have decided to hide out from the world and be a child - fine, but don't then try to act like you're an adult.

9:39 AM, August 04, 2009  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Put the house pig into combat. Let's see how she fares.

9:40 AM, August 04, 2009  
Blogger Dave Cornutt said...

Simon, it's actually even worse than that. Those "XYZ Studies" degrees actually have a negative net worth, because smart employers have learned to regard them as red flags. They know that a person with an XYZ Studies degree not only doesn't have applicable skills, but they are also likely to be un-trainable, and will spend their time at work looking for grievance opportunities. As workers, they will cost more to employ than they will make for the organization.

If you have a degree in XYZ Studies, and you are looking for a job, you're better off if you don't put it on your resume.

10:33 AM, August 04, 2009  
Blogger Dr.Alistair said...

the most money i ever made was on a golf course (well, two different ones actually....) my first wife and i would take pictures of golfers in foursomes at tee off, and by the 18th hole thier pictures would be delivered, in thier minds impossibly quickly....

we made sometimes $1000 a day.

the only training i had for this was my ability to talk to people in ways they appreciated.

i didn`t even know how to use the camera. thankfully my wife was good with one.

we made so much money that it took me away from real estate sales.

the business has diminished in recent years with digital photography. the magic has gone now that you can do the same job on-side with a digital printer.

in those days i had a deal with a local quickprint place to do a three hour turnaround for glossy prints from 35 mm film.

ah, the good old days.

my wife thought she and her friend could do the job on thier own and she left me over it.

the two girls did ok for the first while, until her friend slept with the golf pro....

20 years on many things have changed, some have not.

and you can`t teach this in any school other than the one we are all born into.

10:47 AM, August 04, 2009  
Blogger javadoug said...

Vermont Senator Bernie Sanders has a poll on his website. Currently, more people who have taken the poll are for universal health care. Pass this on and make your vote count. Click on the following link:

10:50 AM, August 04, 2009  
Blogger Dr.Alistair said...

house pig? tether, dude...your slips showing.

10:51 AM, August 04, 2009  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Right. Bush or McCain would have created jobs! Or Palin?
fact: white collar work goes to India. Blue collar work to China.
And corporations don't give a hoot who runs the White House...$$$
stop blaming this or that party and wake up to how work has been transformed.

10:51 AM, August 04, 2009  
Blogger TMink said...

How about you stop appologizing and excusing every criticism of the Democratic congress and administration?

The facts are that Bush was poor on jobs. Even given the contraction caused by the Democratic congress, Bush II was too big government to create enough jobs.

Them's the facts.

Bad policy/ big government leads to fewer jobs. So we are in for a huge mess with the current big government fetishists.


1:06 PM, August 04, 2009  
Blogger Dave Cornutt said...

Trey, if you'll allow me to restate your premise as "Bush was poor on constraining the cost of government", then I'm totally in agreement with you. Bush's overall economic policy was not too bad, but the failure to constrain the growth of government was the elephant in the room. Of course, with the bunch we've got in Washington now, it's way beyond benign neglect -- their explicit agenda is to make government much, much bigger, and damn the economic consequences.

1:32 PM, August 04, 2009  
Blogger TMink said...

Dave, I think you said it better than I, it would be a great upgrade for me to adopt your phrasing.

I will go a bit farther on your last point, I think that the economic consequences are part of the point. By punishing the middle class and private sector with higher taxes, they make us less economically healthy and more likely to accept the government giving us back our own money.

In the same way, drug addiction is worse among the poor, they are miserable and the drugs provide some relief in the short term.


1:48 PM, August 04, 2009  
Blogger M2inFLA said...

As parents, we are helping our son with his college search - he is a senior this year and plans to attend college in the fall of 2010.

During our college visits this past spring, we made it a point to visit the career placement office to ask how their graduating seniors were doing. We were most pleased to see that engineers not only were seeing nearly 100% placement, but that many had multiple job offers.

However at some schools that had liberal arts as well as engineering degree programs, we saw quite a difference - the non-engineering disciplines were not getting the easy job offers. Only those who participated in the intern and coop programs were getting any interest by employers.

We also asked about on-campus job fairs. During one of our visits, a fair was underway, so we took the time to ask these companies about jobs - many were hiring, but were very selective. They could easily tell the students that could work hard and those that might be a risk.

I encourage all potential students to spend some critical time in the career placement offices during their college visits to get a better idea of what the job prospects are.

Don't be that student who sues their school because they cannot find a job because of their chosen field, like the recent news story.

2:48 PM, August 04, 2009  
Blogger DADvocate said...

fred, with the U.S. having one of the highest, if not the highest, corporate tax rate in the world, you can expect outsourcing to continue.

I graduated with my B.A. during the Carter years. No great jobs then. After two years, went to graduate school. Graduated again during the Reagan years. His policies hurt my particular job sector.

12 years ago I went through a divorce and needed better employment. Worked full-time and went to college full-time for a year taking computer programming classes. Sent out over 300 resumes during that time. Got the best job of my life. It really wasn't that hard, unless you expect things on a silver platter.

3:59 PM, August 04, 2009  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

5:13 PM, August 04, 2009  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I graduated from university in 1999 with an engineering degree, and in 2002 with a law degree. I only worked directly in those two fields for a short time, as I leveraged them for other opportunities.

Today I'm a small business owner. And I'd love to be able to hire one or two recent university graduates who've got some good research skills and creativity, to help expand my business.

But unfortunately, I have to say that Obama's policies are discouraging me from hiring. I know he plans tax increases on people who dare make over $250K - so right there, where's my incentive to expand? Plus he wants to do greenhouse gas cap-and-trade, which will push up the cost of everything -- fuel, heating costs, transportation, and in turn the prices of goods and services -- and so that will cause increased costs for my business. And he's going on a witless journey of government expansion on health care which I don't understand -- and which is creating uncertainty for businesses like me. What costs am I going to face in the future as a result of all this? All likely higher.

Put all these factors together and you have me, a business owner who could hire some bright college grads, sitting on the fence. And small business owners like me are the ones who traditionally lead the economic recovery.

To every college grad who wants a job: vote out the Democrats in the 2010 midterms. Put some smart, fiscally responsible people in Congress instead, who understand how business thinks.

Obama, Pelosi, Reid and Barney Frank are all destroying business competitiveness and business confidence. Until those are restored, the hiring won't begin.

5:16 PM, August 04, 2009  
Blogger Swen said...

Interesting discussion. I'm sure there are many reasons why new college graduates are having difficulty finding work, but from the perspective of an employer, I've got to say that unrealistic expectations are right up there.

I've had kids with brand new bachelor's and no job experience who seriously expected to be hired for senior management positions requiring advanced degrees and years of experience. Yes, they'd read the job description, but skipped the part about qualifications and went straight to the part about salary and benefits. Some had absolutely no interest in taking a job commensurate with their education and experience. Why would they want that job when this other job paid so much more?

Quite to my chagrin, I've also hired a few folks who seemed to think that putting in an appearance at work was asking almost too much and actually doing anything was above and beyond. I suppose that might explain why these coffee room commandos didn't see any point in having a job they were qualified for, they didn't plan on actually doing anything so they might as well be paid well!

I don't know where this unrealistic attitude comes from. At the risk of losing my pop psychologist's license, I could speculate that it's a product of an education system that builds self esteem at the expense of an actual education. Or a by-product of our general "I want it all and I want it now" mentality coupled with the drumbeat of advertising telling us we can have it all and we can have it now. Maybe it's just watching too much television where the characters have exciting adventures and lavish life styles but no visible means of support. Perhaps their parents simply didn't teach them anything about delayed gratification?

A work ethic does often seem to be a foreign concept, moreso in social sciences college graduates than in the hard sciences and blue collar positions. I'm sure that couldn't have anything to do with what they've learned in all those 'no attendance taken, everybody passes' classes.

I'm sure it's all much more complicated than my speculations. Sadly, whatever these kids lack in their education, they will get in the school of hard knocks. Perhaps it has been ever so..

5:21 PM, August 04, 2009  
Blogger Dr.D said...

br549 said...

"Is any college / university going to offer worthless programs yielding worthless degrees? Of course not."

I think you are mistaken here. Just about any program with "Studies" in the name, such as "Women's Studies," "Black Studies," "White Studies," etc. are totally worthless, unless you want to be a community organizer and then run for president.

You might ask why a college or university would offer a worthless degree program. The answer is pretty simple. They draw minority students, which is good for the politically correct image, and faculty of the same ilk. They are a 100% scam, but schools willingly lend their names to this because of the money that it brings in and the fact that it keeps government heat off of them for Affirmative Action. It is all a big game, and they play it well. I have been there, as a faculty member.

9:01 PM, August 04, 2009  
Blogger AST said...

This is why there were so many comparisons to Jimmy Carter, who also was an unknown quantity following a president who had incurred wrath, but wasn't nearly as bad as the one who followed. I thought that both were cases of voters not learning from history.

Sadly, we seem to have to learn by our own bad judgment, but, boy, trillion dollar deficits to be paid by future generations are a steep price, and we still don't have the assurance that we've learned anything. The press adulation has faded, but it hasn't turned into words of wisdom, as far as I can see. The MSM are still largely socialists, despite the lessons of history and our current experience, and they'll still support arguments that the problem is just that we haven't tried enough socialism.

AVS is a good sign, but absent a leader on the right, I'm not sure it will be enough to save us from Obama's folly.

10:06 PM, August 04, 2009  
Blogger Ken said...

The young people deserve to lose their jobs. They voted the Democrat/Communist party into power, so that they wouldn't have to risk their precious cowardly asses in war.

After all, they had so much more important things to do, like witchcraft and polyamory.

The Greatest Generation went to the Battle of the Bulge and Iwo Jima.

My dad's generation went to the Moon.

Even the spoiled Baby Boomers went to Vietnam, and my lousy GenX did serve some time in the Gulf War.

The current generation? To the extent they go anywhere, it's either to sex shops or "metaphysical," i.e., superstitious, stores.

Talk about the worst generation. Cowardly, superstitious, and obsessed with sex, although I suspect they're not even very good at it. But hey, they're worse at every thing else, so sex wins by default.

11:39 PM, August 04, 2009  
Blogger Just me said...

As an unemployed Obama voter (who, prior to massive layoffs was an upper-middle class home owner) I AM pissed off. Yet, not at Obama.

I once was a Republican messaging and fund raising consultant who worked for the RNC, G.W. Bush, Gov. Ehrlich, etc., before going to work for charities.

Until 2004 I had voted for Republican's all my life. I'll never, ever, ever vote for one again.

For all of you who think health care is so simple (note: I used to think that) try getting it on your own. I'm 32, healthy, don't smoke and I exercise 5x a week. The cheapest option for me: $495 a month with a $20k deductible and does not cover drug costs.

Again, I am genuinely pissed off. But not at Obama. Warning to Republicans - when you lose me, you are in danger of losing a hell of a lot of people.

12:58 AM, August 05, 2009  
Blogger Ken said...

When you are in danger of losing a Democrat hired liar, you are in danger of losing a hell of a lot of Democrat hired liars.

1:22 AM, August 05, 2009  
Blogger Just me said...

Dear Ken,

If I'm a Democrat hired liar then please accept this challenge. Please call the MD GOP, McCain Campaign, Ken Mehlman, former Gov. Ehrlich, Sen. Richard Burr, former Sen Elizabeth Dole, etc. OH! Even Michael Steele (he's a very nice guy to share many beers with).

I'll be happy to give you my information and my former companies information. In fact, you probably don't need to call if you want to check out FEC reports for Response Consulting (the fundraising firm I assisted in starting). We were based out of Arlington, VA. if that helps work out your anger at all. Just FYI - it's now Response America.

Get a clue. You have no idea what goes on behind the damn curtain. People like you are what drove me out of the party.

3:07 AM, August 05, 2009  
Blogger TMink said...

"The cheapest option for me: $495 a month with a $20k deductible and does not cover drug costs."

You either live in a Blue city or a horrible shopper.

Or a liar.


8:45 AM, August 05, 2009  
Blogger Larry J said...

The current generation? To the extent they go anywhere, it's either to sex shops or "metaphysical," i.e., superstitious, stores.

In fairness, there's a small percentage of the current generation who're serving in the military today. They volunteered in time of war and many of them have served multiple tours of duty in places like Iraq and Afghanistan. While they're a small percentage of the current generation, they're doing outstanding work in the military and this aging Baby Boomer veteran salutes them.

It's a large percentage of the rest of their generation that aren't worth a bucket of warm spit.

9:32 AM, August 05, 2009  
Blogger TMink said...

I think part of the problem is that even good, well meaning parents have some difficulty understanding what texting and photo mail means. I did not.

Once I saw in my practice that those two inventions lead to unsupervised (and thus occasionaly feral) communication between teens, I cut my daughters texting and photo email off.

I discuss the matter with the parents in my practice and make sure that they understand the implications of texting and photos.

In a similar issue, a well intentioned parent had promised her son a PS3 and the game of his choice for all As. He was close to his goal and had asked for the latest Grand Theft Auto game. The boy was 12. The mom did not know that the character in the game can gain health points through manual or oral stimulation or intercourse from prostitutes and that it is common practice in the game to kill the woman after the act. There are videos of the same on youtube.

So I told her.

Her son was angry with me, but I explained that I would not allow my children to have something like that and cared about him enough to make sure his mom had the info she needed to make a good choice.

He forgave me. She was very grateful. She was a good mom, she just had no idea that material like that was in video games. Overall, the kids I see in my practice who struggle the worst are from uninvolved or overwhelmed parents, usually single mothers. But even those of us who try and try hard are sometimes ignorant and leave our kids open to bad interactions that harm them.


11:39 AM, August 05, 2009  
Blogger Ken said...

Just me, your list of friends sounds like a Who's Who of the gun control wing of the GOP. That's in a 75% pro-gun nation. Let me guess, even when you were a Republican you probably talked about the NRA as if it were an embarassment.

Personally, I come from a part of America that isn't ashamed to do American things. I guess I must be overcompensating for my small penis.

2:56 PM, August 05, 2009  
Blogger Dr.Alistair said...

tmink, i think that most parents, for thier niavity regarding media and telecommunications, miss the feral content of some teens messages.

i think my girlfriend turns a blind eye to most of her teen-age daughter`s "stuff", and frankly i couldn`t begin to address it with her....even though she works with teens as a childcare worker.

i guess she`s a classic case of "not my child".

regarding grand theft auto, the mother of my children denys most of what i say about things like the content of such games, but thankfully, there is enough info posted on youtube about it that she couldn`t deny it.

she still let them see borat and jerky boys and will in all likelyhood let them see bruno.

in my view, there is "too liberal".

most of the children i see in family counselling smirk at the niavety of thier parent`s understanding of thier media...and i do direct the parents to the risk areas...mostly to thier shock, suprise and embarrassment.

3:15 PM, August 05, 2009  
Blogger TMink said...

Ken, I recently read very different stats about American support of gun control. What is your source?



3:40 PM, August 05, 2009  
Blogger TMink said...

Ken, here is a link from Pew, a good polling organization, that shows gun control support slipping along with support for abortion. It is nowhere near the number you cited.

It is also important to note the lack of specifity of the questions. I am a gun owner, and I support some limited gun control laws. I do not support making automatic weapons legal. So I would have been counted as supporting gun control, when my support is very, very limited.

Here is the link. Tell me what you think about the numbers. I look forward to yours.


3:47 PM, August 05, 2009  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Dr.D, that was a joke. Half of what is offered in higher education is bull hockey.

Re-read my post.

4:36 PM, August 06, 2009  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

It would "make a lot of money like he did under Clinton."
Email Marketing Solutions

6:12 AM, August 10, 2009  

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